TV News Covers the Politics of Second Life

TV News Covers the Politics of Second Life

May 11, 2007
We're hearing a lot these days about how political campaigns are interacting with the virtual world of Second Life.

News station WSYR-9 (Syracuse, NY) looks at the politics of Second Life in this video report.

It's interesting to watch how the obviously non-gaming members of the WSYR-9 newsroom react to the concept of SL's virtual space.

Comments

Not so sure I buy the Second Life is the future of the Internet part. Maybe something similar, though. On the bright side, they didn't make it out to be a negative thing that slowly erodes the morals and values of society. The report seemed rather positive. It wasn't well done though (the voice-over was constantly speaking over someone on-screen).
Sociologists could learn a lot from Second Life.
Foundation anyone?
How does second life stay popular? I barely can get a solid framrate, and everything is constantly loading and being buggy? Seriously, it is probably the worst place on the internet
its more like MMO for noobs, and thats why its so popular with people who dont usually use coomputers. Like myspace, there really isnt any pointexept social networking, and the fact that you can make quick money off of it legally.
crispyfritters, you say "social networking" as if that's a bad thing. Yeah, its about social networking -- like the telephone, email, and texting.

SL has very little to do with FPS and much more to do with people wanting to connect in new and entertaining ways with other people. Sure, its not likely to sway the outcome of the elections in 2008, but a politician would be wise not to ignore these virtual communities.
The sad thing is they're treating SL like it's a brand new amazing game when it's a four year old game that looks like an incomplete game engine for another game.
Frankly, given the response to the campaign sites placed in SL already, politicians would be VERY wise to ignore these communities. Second Life is already associated with child pornography rings, age-play groups, money laundering, etc. Why subject your campaign to association with these things, however tenuous the connection, when you can just campaign to the same people in First Life?
@Eric Lamy

Probably to prove that they're "with the times," to younger voters in particular. You make a good point, being associated with SL is poison if your opponents have good spin doctors on their side.
I'd rather they make lame attempts at "being down" with video games than putting them down. ;)
I certainly agree, and let's be honest here, SL is much more than just a pornography distribution center. But because of its courting of the media, it has subjected itself to a much more rigorous evaluation of any faults it might have. There is probably far more child pornography being distributed through MySpace or over GMail than on Second Life, but by ignoring the problem for so long the Lindens have made a difficult situation positively radioactive. While I applaud their apparent intentions to restrict age play within the community now that the matter has become a legal situation, this is likely the beginning of the death knell for Linden's laissez-faire community standards policies and, by extension, much of the draw of Second Life as an entity.
I didn't know SL had such a seedy underbelly. What's "age play"?
I joined Second Life over six months ago...... I haven't played it in over six months, aside from the technical problems, I just didn't find it the least bit entertaining.
@Vladimir

Unfortunately, most don't realize how much of Second Life really is rather "seedy" to the point where the term "underbelly" really fails to grasp at the extent to which it is prevalent. Disregarding whether sex really constitutes 5% of SL (Hamlet Linden - http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2007/02/a_census_of_sec.html) or 60% (Prokofy Neva - http://secondthoughts.typepad.com/second_thoughts/2007/02/i_started_this...), it is difficult to avoid encountering some form of pornographic content just skimming through the various sims in SL. The worst of this is of course the child pornography, and while I have not personally encountered any actual photographs uploaded into SL (according to the German report there was a fair amount found in a relatively short period of investigation), I have encountered the phenomenon of age play on more than one occasion. This is essentially the use of Second Life's avatar modification utilities to model oneself as a child, and then engage in sexual acts with other avatars using this model. There are a number of age play prostitutes for hire within SL, and the Lindens have known about it for some time, going so far as to recommend to reporters that they take a look at it in their SL visits. That they are now making a complete about-face on the issue is comforting but not, it seems, altogether sincere.
"A candidate has no need to put up a flat web page when they can create a... space"

No NEED? I think The Internet has a few more users than Second Life does, and is a bit more accessible.
Second Life is a virtual chatroom with a horribly outdated but open-ended graphics system that lets people produce and take pride in hideous crap, most of which involves some bizarre fetish. I'm pretty sure Second Life is where all the pedophiles, furries, and scat fetishists migrated to when Yahoo closed user-created chat rooms.
Eric, I couldn't disagree more. I've been in SL for more than a year and I very rarely come across pornographic content. Provocative perhaps, but not porn.

Sure, you can find it if you search for it, just like the net. But it doesn't jump out at you everywhere you go.
I have to agree with crispyfritters. It totally looks like a game for noobs. I have never played it, but being a net admin at work, I find plenty of stupid people playing it. I usually catch my really dumb users playing it at work and using it for porn AT WORK. I busted one guy playing it with porn all over the place right on the retail floor! I hate that game and I've never even played it!
Riko, I think that if, as I gather from your blog and what I've read from you previously, your intent in using Second Life is of an academic nature, it's easy to sift through the filth and find some really neat content. I've attended Harvard law courses, watched feature length films, and had some great philosophical discussions in SL, and seen some really well designed sims along the way. But given all that I would still posit that the vast majority of content in Second Life is geared towards sex, if not outright pornographic. That this material isn't simply strewn about everywhere doesn't change the degree to which it is prevalent and easily accessible.
Well, if you let people live out their fantasies and create pretty much whatever they want, it'll usually be at least slightly sexual in nature no matter who is creating it. Everything from innuendo to disgusting fetishes.
i live in syracuse! woah!
@AbsumZero: Why on earth are you including a fandom - Furries - in with sexual fetishes and deviations? At its most basic level, "Furry," in and of itself, has nothing to do with sex.

@Nekojin

Still doesn't make it any less as creepy.
@Nekojin

"@AbsumZero: Why on earth are you including a fandom - Furries - in with sexual fetishes and deviations? At its most basic level, “Furry,” in and of itself, has nothing to do with sex."

Thank you, at least someone on this board understands that very basic fact.
@John Sadly, that's more attributed to the fact that their servers are as far as I hear pretty outdated and they don't have nearly enough

@AbsumZer0 So long as the people who make the items are satisfied, what's the problem? And since when did graphics on a game matter all that much? I mean, sure, it pays to see what you're doing and it does help to have a pretty face, but Second Life is partly about making your own fun. Hell, I visited a combat zone yesterday and tested my shooting skills. With the proper items SL easily becomes a first person shooter.
@Nekojin-
Because the current use of the term 'furries' typically denotes a fandom in as much as 'pedophiles' describes fans of children. Almost everyone likes anthromorphic animals, regardless of culture, and the attributing of human characteristics to animals spans back at least as far as recorded history. I’m sure the term once applied to general fans of anthromorphic creatures, mammals in particular, but thanks to the negative connotation it’s derived from the folks who dress-up in mascot costumes and rub each other off , draw cartoons of their ‘fursonas’ wearing diapers and bashfully crapping themselves, or log-on to Second Life and have cybersex with animal avatars, normal people who just happen to be fans of anthromorphs have distanced themselves from the term.

@Kurisu-
There's nothing inherently wrong with the engine so long as people enjoy it. The problem is with all the hype. It comes nowhere near close to living up to any of it and the fact that actual politicians use it to stump and real businesses and news agencies are spending money on establishing an in-game presence is ridiculous. And for what? Seriously, a huge chunk of transactions the Lindens keep track of and brag about are for in-game gambling and bootleg in-game pornography.

http://valleywag.com/tech/second-life/virtual-worlds-supposed-economy-is...

http://www.secondlifeherald.com/slh/2007/02/phony_second_li.html
Attempting to put a percentage on how much "sex" there is inside Second Life is like asking how much "sex" there is on the net, or even in real life. Doubtlessly a lot for all three, but exactly how much depends on perspective. If I was a gaffer in the porn video industry I'd probably say the whole world is 90% porn. I almost never *see* it in SL... but then I don't go looking for it either.

As to complaints about the visual graphics, there's a big difference between a videogame and a real-time virtual world which has built-in tools allowing people to create 3D objects... in real time. At the most basic, the models themselves are different; videogames are almost exclusively pre-made polyon meshes whereas SL uses something closer to what CAD applications use (the avatar mesh in SL is actually *one* pre-made mesh with slider controls to offset portions of it; nothing more).

This system is used (according to what I recall hearing from LL) to improve the dynamic loading of the geometry; it's faster. However, by default at this stage of development, that means having graphics which don't match the less bandwidth-constrained videogames out there (SL is a 50Mb download whereas most games now are running ten or twenty times that). Eventually this kind of technology will catch up, but to compare them now is, imo, a mistake.

With regard to "hype", as someone who routinely criticizes Linden Lab's actions and policies, the one thing I can't say is that I believe they've "hyped" it. They have a business and they have a product. They sell that product just like any other business. I rarely see ads for SL. I rarely hear of LL doing anything more than giving interviews and going out to give presentations. Is that "hype". Not in my book.

Now if you're referring to Clay Shirky's drivel, I'd (once again) take issue with what this individual had to say... mostly because a) he admitted to not really being familiar with or even using SL and b) because he clearly made the same mistake he accused the MSM when dealing the "hype" card: he didn't do his research. I won't waste words here, but for details, you can either start with a post I made about it ( http://blog.rebang.com/?p=1179 ) or go directly to another site on which I both commented and left a bunch of links to Terra Nova threads in which Shirky was involved ( http://www.howardowens.com/2007/be-skeptical-of-the-hype-around-virtual-... ).

If there is a videogame that does anything like what SL does, please provide a link. I'd love to check it out.

If there is a videogame/virtual world developer that provides more statistics than Linden Lab, please provide a link. I'm not saying that LL doesn't play word games. On the contrary, long before Shirky some of us were pointing out issues regarding user numbers and dollar figures. Only I hope most of us are sufficiently intelligent (unlike most of MSM) to see through the smokescreen thrown up not just by LL, but by most every Web 2.0 company hoping to promote themselves.

With regard to the recent issues regarding child porn, I think we should separate the RL stuff from the virtual stuff. No one is arguing that the RL stuff needs to be addressed, but that goes for not just SL but for a whole lot of internet sites (especially the new YouTube pron-clones). However, if I'm not mistaken, the "virtual porn" issue is still up for serious debate, and I, for one, am not ready to throw an adult in prison for navigating a set of pixels into personally visually-stimulating compositions with another adult controlling a different set of pixels and doing the same. So long as no one is harmed, the idea that we would prosecute individuals for such victimless crimes makes no sense to me. And while there is the oft-used argument that such behavior is connected to real life pedophilia, I don't buy that anymore than I buy the idea that people who frag others in FPS deathmatches are necessarily encouraged to go on killing sprees in their community.

Lastly, if there is one thing that I hope we can all agree upon, it's that SL is interesting... and sometimes interesting because it highlights the difference in attitudes we have regarding certain issues. Personally, I'd rather these things be learned, studied and resolved in ugly 3D chatrooms than in real life.

GamePolitics ShoutBox

Posted 11/08/09 at 09:02am
DarkSaber: http://tinyurl.com/yez7jyo
Posted 11/08/09 at 09:01am
DarkSaber: Oh for gods sake, the Gearbox pres is gobbing off about Valve again
Posted 11/08/09 at 08:53am
JDKJ: But cheer up, Austin. If the unemployment rate continues to double-digit as predicted for the next few years, your half-dozen stands a better than likely chance of returning to power.
Posted 11/08/09 at 08:46am
JDKJ: @DS: If he had added the line about "or hiring illegals aliens under the table to work as nannies," it would have been a completely perfect descripition. And, yes, it's about the same difference between a six and a half-dozen.
Posted 11/08/09 at 08:31am
DarkSaber: My god, that description makes them sound almost Republican. Still what did you expect, Obama is only marginally more left than republicans.
Posted 11/08/09 at 01:07am
Austin_Lewis: Health insurance, brought to you by the same kind of bureacrats who couldn't, in timely fashion, investigate the comments of any of the men Obama appointed Czars. Or their past. Or their history of not paying taxes.
Posted 11/08/09 at 01:06am
Austin_Lewis: Yes, and what a piece of crap it was. Arresting and fining people just because they don't make a personal choice to buy healh insurance, creating over a hundred new bureacracies, and worse.
Posted 11/08/09 at 12:24am
ZippyDSMlee: JDKJ:the only trouble is a bunch of witless hacks wrote it....its going to be a train wreck....
Posted 11/07/09 at 11:33pm
JDKJ: BREAKING: In a photo-finish at the wire, House passes health care reform bill. Relatedly, in a fit of pique, Austin Lewis kicks innocent dog.
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:27pm
ZippyDSMlee: man I got alot of junk and dup files too >< god I need orginization...and no not the knee capping media mafia kind :P
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:26pm
ZippyDSMlee: replaced :P
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:23pm
ZippyDSMlee: beemoh:hey its like 60GB porn,400GB anime 100GB games and crap I have took from all my DVDs, I hate waiting on dvds to install stuff..... oh and 40GB of my porn was in the found.000 folder...mostly corrupted.... least I got names of wut needs to be repa
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:18pm
beemoh: @Zip: ...and you'd have to spend all that time re-downloading that porn?
Posted 11/07/09 at 03:34pm
ZippyDSMlee: ggrrrrr......vista lost one of my hard drives and I had a heart attack thinking I lost 1TB of data....
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:58am
JDKJ: Which could be explained by both (a) and (b).
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:56am
Austin_Lewis: JDKJ: You forgot C) the fact that, for some reason, every time he did something that would suggest he shouldn't be in the military, let alone an officer, higher ups ignored it or let it slide.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:51am
JDKJ: Part of the problem is, I believe, that (a) the Army had a lot of time and money already invested in him and which they were unwilling to simply write-off and (b) an increasing need for the type of skills and services he provided.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:48am
JDKJ: And that even if he was begging not to get cut loose, he was apparently a real good candidate for being cut loose, anyway.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:11am
JDKJ: @chada: And while Kennedy once noted that there's usually more than enough blame for everyone to get a slice, the possibility that the Army was unwilling to cut loose someone who was asking to get cut loose could be a factor.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:07am
ZippyDSMlee: *noms on his feet*..nomnomnomnom*droooll* ...wuuutttttt uuu looking at?
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