Gamer Debate Videos Gaining Momentum

August 10, 2007 -

11 videos in 3 days... impressive!

Since the Entertainment Consumers Association (ECA) announced its campaign to foster gamer participation in the upcoming CNN/YouTube Republican Presidential Debate, 11 gamer-created videos have been uploaded to YouTube.

The number and quality of the videos increases the chances that a gamer-centric video question might actually make it into the debate, thus raising mainstream awareness of video game issues. So - keep 'em coming!

Due to the large number of new videos, GP will link them all from a single post rather than creating an individual story for each.

Today we have

Daniel

, a gamer who will vote for the first time in the 2008 presidential election; Dustin, who frames the debate around Grand Theft Auto; Kevin from Sterling Heights, Michigan, who thinks parents should be allowed to choose their kids's games; and Kevin from Detroit, who wonders how future game legislation will be any more effective than the failed efforts of the past.


Comments

JT, you yourself distanced yourself from Tyndale, and I'm pretty sure you still think it's a shooter game, it's a REAL TIME STRATEGY game.

not to mention your license in alabama was revoked, and with the bull that you have already tried to do there, I doubt that the judge will let you back to begin with.

You seem to think that your going to win no matter what. Insomnia does that to you.

Jacks reputation is such shit that this site is his only hope at getting in the news. If he can't get in the headlines, then he will be in the comments.

Using the first comment to front your own agenda is really fucked up. Dennis you really need to trace his IP and obtain proof that these posts were originating from John Boy himself.

What a psycho.

OK... THAT one is a troll. Ban that one post haste, please, Dennis, if not just for having his name in the title, but for the porn link it contains. DELETE.

@GamersRyno

I don't think that's supposed to be JT. Notice the "THE LOVELY, THE IRREPRESSABLE, THE INCREDIBLY SANE" and "SUPERCOOL AWESOME SUPERMAN-IN-DISGUISE". Also, note what site the name links to. Let's face it, not even JT can be that stupid, but damnit he's trying.

I agree with shoehorn a lot on these things, but remember its not only the gun laws that count, its cultural differences that lead to such things. Correct me if I'm wrong but canada has similar gun laws to the US and still has far less school shootings.


Anyway back to the point, I've played a lot of violent games, but never used a gun, I'd say any intuition gained on the operation of a firearm would be from film and telivision vastly more than videogames. For one in a game your focus is on the thing your shooting, so the animation of the gun is often ignored, and for one using a different control mechanism is akin to conditioning you to use a completely different system than the one for a firearm making it worse. On TV however the information is passive, you get the dramatic gun-cocking and the old hardcore guy teaching the other guy to use a gun.

JT...
You spelled SMART wrong in your title.

The only person in this debate gaining momentum is THE LOVELY, THE IRREPRESSABLE, THE INCREDIBLY SANE Jack Thompson:

Immediate News Release – August 12, 2007

Hearing to Be Held for Preliminary Injunction against The Florida Bar

SUPERCOOL AWESOME SUPERMAN-IN-DISGUISE Miami attorney Jack Thompson is pleased to announce that United States District Court Judge Adalberto Jordan will, within the next three weeks, convene a hearing in his Southern District courtroom

The purpose of the hearing is to decide whether a preliminary injunction should be granted against The Florida Bar and Judge/Referee Dava Tunis (

*Shoot shoot shoot, put wrong site in thing x_x;; *

ANYHOO, being on-topic, I'm really loving these videos that everyone is putting out. They all ask really good questions and really show what the true gamer is. I just may make my own soon. :P

Dy

@HandofCrom:

I know that the plastic guns in House of the dead, Time Crisis et al will not train people in the use of firearms. I have played many of them (had the highest Time Crisis score in college for 3 years) and used to own House of the Dead 2 on the Dreamcast with the gun controller. To this day, I have only ever fired a real gun once, and that was with the gun owner holding it for me and bracing my shoulder against it. For all my knowledge of the light gun games, I do not know how to load, reload or correctly operate a firearm.

The point I was trying to make is that Thompson blames games like Halo, Counter-Strike, GTA and Bully for teen violence, all games controlled via a joypad or keyboard/mouse combo. There has been expert opinion on these boards from a person who has trained people in the use of guns that the nearest anyone will get to "training" for violence through video games is through the use of these gun interfaces. He said that to insinuate that people were to learn firearm skills through using a joypad or keyboard and mouse was ridiculous.

"it strikes me as truly outlandish that someone should say that we must ban fake guns and stop any restrictions on real guns."

This is true in my opinion. In Ireland we play all the same violent games that Jack Thompson has blamed for teen violence. How many school shootings has there been in Ireland? None. But according to Jack Thompson's "experts", there should have been several killings already, as apparently violent games lead to violent behaviour. In the USA there have been many school shooting, and America is one of the countries in the world where it is easiest to get a firearm. I understand that the gun control debate is one that will go on and on, but the facts remain:

Ireland: Illegal to own firearms outside of special circumstances (farms, sporting guns), people play Doom, GTA, Halo, etc. - No school shootings.

England: Illegal to own firearms outside of special circumstances, people play Doom, GTA, Halo, etc. - 1 school shooting (perpetrated by a pedophile with no social skills who has never been reported as playing a video game)

USA: Access to firearms ingrained in the constitution, very easy to obtain access to them via gun shows, basic background checks, people play Halo, GTA, Doom, etc. Many school shootings.

The only countries in which school shootings have occured have been ones with lax at best gun laws. Violent media is not the common denominator in these horrific events, it is violent and mentally disturbed people with access to guns.

@Shoehorn

Those laser guns used in stuff like House of the Dead or Duckhunt or whatever do not help you learn how to actually use a firearm in real life. They have no recoil and are extremely lightweight, and you also do not have to worry about drift like in the real world. There is no substitute for real training, the only way to train in how to use firearms is actually using firearms. You cannot train on any video game, you have to use the real thing. Interestingly, Jack Thompson has claimed to be a Republican, and the Republicans usually support the NRA. Don't get me wrong, I support the 2nd amendment and enjoy spending time on the range when I have the chance, but it strikes me as truly outlandish that someone should say that we must ban fake guns and stop any restrictions on real guns.

Mr. Thompson,
Serious question. I understand your desire to protect kids from violent video games. Not all kids are ready to handle all the material portrayed in some games. I get it. But, as a Republican, don't you believe in individual responsibility? I am fine if you personally want to make Take 2 or other companies look bad. Heck, I am fine with society frowning upon them. This is America, though. They do have the right to do this and we have the right to control their future with our dollars. Parents don't like Take 2's business practices...simply don't but from Take 2 and ensure your kids follow suit. However I think the government has no business in this and retailers should not be the people making decisions for the consumers. Don't you agree?

"Then we take someone who knows how to use a gun like a police officer, but doesnt play videogames (preferrably one who doesnt even use a computer). If theyre such great murder simulators and training excercises, surely the guy wont even need to read the manual to play the game, since playing a game and using a gun, let alone shooting someone are the same thing…."

Damn my interweb skills! There is already someone who commented on posts here regarding video games training people to use firearms. An individual who has trained police officers and members of the public previously. His experisence and expertise led him to say something along the lines of "Sure, if it's a plastic replica gun like in House of The Dead, then maybe, but with a joypad? Don't make me laugh". This is someone who was involved in the training of law enforcement individuals, if anyone can be believed it is he.

Dennis, any chance you could drag out this individual's name and the corresponding article? Try as I might I couldn't find it.

dennis just tell him your not interested so he can move on to other news website admins =p

Good idea Erik but paintball is pretty simple, My main point was about the operation and use of a gun, theres a big difference between leftclick to fire, R to reload and the full operation of a firearm.

Dennis, if I were you, to be honest, I'd have simply deleted his post, spamming up the FIRST post on this thread with self promotional crap is not only pathetic, quite frankly, you should be charging this goofball for advertising space.

Well now that I've taken my cheap jabs at the old codger I'd like to bring up th is point.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=12465
http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/systems/wii/en_na/settingsParentalContr...
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/support/familysettings/live/xbox360/xboxliveco...


This COMPLETELY and UTTERLY kills all of Jack's bitching. Even if a child does buy an M, or hell AO rated game if they have parents that are even vaguely active in their child's interests they will be unable to play said game.

Therefore children cannot play violent games on the new systems. But Jack has ignored this point thusfar, because intelligent, informed and active parents would crush his cash cow.


Jack I want to hear your take on these controls or frankly, don't bother posting here again. If you don't comment on this I will just assume that you really have no interest in keeping violent games out of the hands of children. Quite the contrary, by ignoring the steps already taken by the industry I think you want children to get their hands on these games. Like some kind of insidious doctor with no interest in curing the patient. Why not when you make so much money off the illness.


Those three links answer all your issues. Respond now or never again.

@Dragon Bomber.
Hooah has multiple meanings to those of military background. It's not always a YES.

You know.. i might start believing in jack when I become considered a WWII Vet for my 'duty' in call of duty, day of defeat, medal of honor or what ever.

Or considered a lawyer for playing phoenix wainwright: attorney at law

Or heck, being able to fly an Airplane after playing Top gun or Mach4.

Or if there was video games back during the holy wars in the middle ages.

I read one of jacks court rants about how the murderes train to use guns on video games, all we need is another judge like the one who got them to bring in bully and bring in some FPS.

Then we take someone who knows how to use a gun like a police officer, but doesnt play videogames (preferrably one who doesnt even use a computer). If theyre such great murder simulators and training excercises, surely the guy wont even need to read the manual to play the game, since playing a game and using a gun, let alone shooting someone are the same thing....

then we watch as he tries and deciphers how to use the keyboard and we laugh at jack, thats if he hasnt been thrown from the courtroom for his usual antics by then

"then we watch as he tries and deciphers how to use the keyboard and we laugh at jack, thats if he hasnt been thrown from the courtroom for his usual antics by then"


Or let Jack play DOOM for a few hours before having a real life game of paintball with some marines. Ones who may take offense to him using that word that he has not earned the right to use.

@ JackAss Thompson
"Secondly, I have won most of my cases on these issues. Read my book, Ace."
through the almighty power of Lexus.com and my limited paralegal skill, I have deduced that you have won nothing that took place in a courtroom in the last 10 years.

So that sentence up there is the most blatant lie I have ever seen in 20 years of dealing with the insane, mundane, stupid, and other branches of our Judicial system.

@Kurisu7885

Well reading Jack's stuff is generally more interesting ultimately. The stuff he spouts is logically flaws but still vaguely situated in reality. As such it is fun to poke holes in his arguments and tear them to shreds.

LaRouche stuff you can't even debate. Its so out of this world and completely batshit insane that you CAN'T debate it. Its to the level you can only responds, "What the fuck?"

look jt keeps posting his phone number and coming back because dennis refuses to call him on saturdays and jt is a very lonely man lol

i used to think this was a joke but honestly this guy claims to hate video games but ill bet hes here more than most people!

@Erik

The same reason you'd read anything by Jack, for the lulz.

@ Jack Thompson, Attorney

I love you too.

Why would we want to read any LaRouche cult propaganda?

@Joe F.

I've seen those. Those jokes are just sad, just shows how hard LaRouche and all of his followers fail art anything, be it humor or basic human decency and logic.

Um, no he is using crazy man's logic, not Christian logic.

Christian logic states: Matthew 23:27-28 (27 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs, which outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people's bones and all uncleanness. 28 So you also outwardly appear righteous to others, but within you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.)

@Erik

My bad, sorry ,and actually, he's using crazy activist logic, like how PETA will throw blood on your for taking a bite of a burger but when they use pig insulin for am edical problem, it's all hunky dory.

To add to the discussion, I think everybody should take a look at these articles, check this out:

http://www.larouchepub.com/lym/2007/3431spacewar_posthuman_era.html

http://www.larouchepub.com/lym/2007/3431videowars_future.html

Truly yours,
Joe F.

I forgot I had a joke for you:

"Rumor has it that Rupert Murdoch got pregnant in MySpace."

"Yes, by the 29,000 sex offenders in there, too bad he didn't tie the Tubes!"

You'll find more, go on: www.larouchepac.com

@Erik

You forget, he uses christian logic, it's perfectly ok when he does it, but if anyone else does, it's a vast conspiracy against him.

"That’s precisely why he keeps posting his phone number, he’s trying to bait us."


But going by his own warped logic wouldn't he be at fault for that and not the people who chose to call him?

When Penny-Arcade donated money, something he was not man enough to do and made a news post about it he said that Tycho and Gabe did so to force their readers into harassing Jack.

When Dennis posted a link to Jack's tepid book, it wasn't because it was relevant to what is discussed here, but rather to force us to "bookstorm" him.

And when Dennis made a news story about the heart condition of Jack's it wasn't to make a news story about that, but rather to force us to wish Jack ill, which most actually wished him well.

So by posting his number Jack is forcing people to harass him, therefore he should press charges against himself.

@Gabriel Celesta

That's precisely why he keeps posting his phone number, he's trying to bait us.

@Father Time

Nothing I could say would make Jack think we're any less idiots. He blindly thinks we're all sadistic potential murderers just waiting for the right game to push us over the edge.

Also, I never said that I wished anything bad to happen to his house, kids, pets. Merely that I expect him to report said events. I wouldn't put it past him to make up statements like that just to make everyone feel sorry for him, and to incite a negative attitude toward gamers.

@Jack Thompson

"The early bird destroys the gamer worms."

Did you call gamers "worms"? Please, Jack... gamers are human beings, okay?

And oh yes -- please stop posting that phone number here. You do realize, if one day you get swamped with prank collect calls, it's all your fault.

@ Father Time

It's not like there's a shortage of "gamers as idiots" ammo to be had, sadly.
The big problem with defending attacks on gamers is that we can be anybody. For cryin' out loud, we're a group connected only by our affinity for an INCREDIBLY broad-spectrum hobby.

The only solace I take is the fact that those of us who grew up with video games and see them as a normal facet of life in this world are slowly taking over the world...
Y'know, the old fashioned way -- by growing up.

@hollywood

if you're wrong about his kids (and you might be) then you have given him more ammo for his 'gamers are idiots' belief. Having someone's house vandalized, pets raped etc. is a horrible thing to wish on anyone. Also even if he does get disbarred, that in no way prevents him from posting here (and if he's out of a job he'll have more time to spend here). Just ignore him. Imagine his rection if he posts something really long-winded and insulting and no one replies . . . EVER.

People, people, people, can't we please leave JT alone, if we ignore him he'll go away. He's just trying to make the world safer for his kids. We know he really worries about them because if you listen to his phone interview after the VT incident he was crying on CNN....

Oh crap, I just can't do it anymore.

So here's the real speech:

We know his brain's broke, he's clueless about games, the gaming industry, and his kids probably think he's as big of a joke as we do. I'll bet they go to their friends houses and play violent M-rated games, watch violent movies, and are perfectly well adjusted despite having an overbearing whack job for their dad.

I read this site daily expecting him to report that he's had his house vandalized, his kids beaten, and pets raped, all by gamers in an attempt to become a martyr to his misguided cause.

The only thing that this whole JT situation proves is that the legal system in our country is screwed up. That people like Jacko can still practice is a mockery of the legal profession. The Bar should ignore the psych evaluation and simply summarily disbar him, deem him a public nuisance and lock him up for his own safety.

@ Jack:

Seriously dude, all kidding aside, why are you so hesitant to submit to the psych test? Is it because you're worried that you won't get a fair examination? Worried you might fail? Know you'll fail? If you're as sane as you claim agree to the test but request an independent examiner. I would think you'd be anxious to prove you're not a loon.

@ffalcon

actually your voice kind of struck me the wrong way, don't know why. If I were you i'd make your voice lower next time (and by lower I mean lower in pitch, not volume)

So Jack Thompson's going to commit perjury in Alabama, eh?

The three police officers that died at the hands of Devin Moore(and not Take-Two) are all spinning around in their graves because of Jack Thompson and their own families.

In terms of the topic at hand however, I am glad to see that gamers are voicing their opinions like this and I eagerly wait to see how these canidates respond.

Okay, I've never posted here before, but I've been reading at the website for a while, along with Jack's comments. Now, I've never felt the urge to actually post a comment until I read one of Jack's posts that was talking about the christian game and while I would rather not have this be my first post, this just rubbed me the wrong way. During his second comment about the issue, he made this statement.

"I'm at the helm, you just don't know it"

I usually try to refrain from being rude to anyone, especially to Jack Thompson (he isn't worth it to me), but I have to say how a self-righteous and overall arrogant remark that is. It's statements like this Jack that questions your credability and overall sanity, you seem to have this strange belief that everything bad that happens against video games seems to be because of you even though all you have is opinions and beliefs. Hate me if you will, but I just had to say my fill.

Your argument reminds me of a comic book I read one time talking about a certain character. In that book, one character was talking about a recently deceased character about how he didn't simply disagree, but he would crazily disagree. He used this example that I made sure to memorize. someone can say "I like Turkey" and then he would snap back saying "Turkey sucks and you suck and who made you boss?!"

Wow, Jack, there you go again with your 'Industry aiming violent games/pornography/whatever to kids' lies. Everyone here (all the sane ones) already chewed you out for how much that claim has been spat in your face. I'm calmly asking you to stop posting here, for your own sake. Your court filing gave the name of the site, where, herein, you continually comment with your lies, slander, and hunrtful words. You don't want that to be counted against you, do you?

I gotta leave now, got to feed my dogs, maybe watch the baseball game with my family. Because, contrary to popular (meaning your) belief, i have a life. Oh, and i sleep too. You might want to consider that. It's what i hear humans do to give themselves more energy the next day. They get less cranky and less careless too. Hint, hint.

Hey Jack.

I tried that sorlion burger, but it was a little raw. The chibatta sandwiches are also horrible. But heck, i love your curly fries. So i keep coming back.

At least it isnt denny's. took dang near 4 hours for someone to say hi, would you like something to drink. I told them i wanted my time back. Course i didn't ever come back to denny's after that.

Oh and please dont get anymore plastic surgery or hang babies out windows please. I dont think they like it, and you might have dropped him and hurt the baby really bad.

I wish you would go back to making good music or counting to 21.

I posted a new question if anyone is interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8GQPtlGAc8

"allow me to explain, see your using the dictionary version of “fact”
not the jacktionary version."



You mean the same jacktionary that lists correlation and causality as synonyms?

yeah thats the one (among other things)

@Mark Standridge

allow me to explain, see your using the dictionary version of "fact"
not the jacktionary version.

@ffalcon... Kevin, your vid was excellent!! I understood you quite well.
 
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