August 16, 2007 -
It's beginning to look as if the focus of the much-discussed Dr. Phil episode has shifted to MMO addiction, not game violence.GamePolitics reported on anti-game attorney Jack Thompson's comments to that effect yesterday. And then there is this solicitation on the Dr. Phil website, seeking parents whose teen spends all of his/her time playing Second Life:
Are you worried your teen is so consumed with the online game, Second Life, that they aren't paying attention to their own life? Have they bragged about earning money and getting a job in the game but haven't moved from the computer screen in days? Are you worried what they're doing in the game and if it's safe? Does your teen argue with you that it's all innocent? Tell us your story.
Comments
This is a very nerve-racking situation. Now talk-show hosts are getting into it. They're going to say Video Games are bad, and everybody's going to agree with them simply because of who they are.
But, at least this isn't Oprah we're dealing with. Everybody not only agrees, but believes in what she says.
This is like saying that Games shoot people.
WoW doesn't kill people. People without basic judgement skills kill themselves.
Some additional questions he might add in here should be:
Are you doing anything about this behaviour?
Is it that difficult to talk to your child about what they are doing?
Are you that WEAK a parent that you have no authority in your home and allow your children to dominate you and do whatever they want?
Are you that CARELESS of a parent that you would allow your child unrestricted access to the internet with no supervision?
Are you that LAZY of a parent that you haven't done any of this already, and would instead prefer to try and have a tv personality magically solve all of your problems for you?
I understand that some people are predisposed to being addicted to certain things (tv, sex, alcohol, drugs, gambling, etc.) Hell, I woul dhave watched television all day and stayed up all night as a child were it not for the fact that my parents knew when to say "That's enough, save your game and switch it off now, it's time for homework/bed/dinner". If a child hasn't moved from the computer screen in days, then it's the parents fault for allowing them to stay there! It's not difficult to activate parental controls, change passwords, set a timetable for when they are allowed play, or even just yank the plug out of the wall! Complaining about a situation that you have power to do something about is just advertising the fact that you are shirking your responsibility.
"Are you worried what they’re doing in the game and if it’s safe?"
Follow up question, "If so, are you worried about your inability to talk with your child and take an interest in what they are doing?". How much effort does it take to go to your kid at the computer and ask "Hey, what are you playing?", and sit there for a while with them as they play, asking the odd question here and there. My Mother did this with me about WoW (in fairness, I was 24-5 at the time, but the principle is the same).
Lack of parental responsibility like this is the reason why they are looking for government to solve their problems for them.
@Bildo
"Does he know that people have died due to WoW?!"
You are being very sarcastic here I hope. It's true that people have died while playing MMOs. but it is not the MMO that killed them. Their lack of responsibility for their own health or the health of others caused these deaths. Nobody has "died due WoW", but they have died due to their own abnormal and unhealthy behaviour.
Thousands of people die in car accidents everyday, but you would never say "People have died due to cars!" Car accidents are caused by driving while impaired, driving recklessly and speeding, etc. It is the individual's behaviour that causes the accidents and deaths, not the activity of driving.
I think I've figured out the utter futility of this upcoming Dr. Phil episode.
Dr. Phil, contacts Jack Thompson, a "violence expert" (who claimed Bully was a columbine simulator) and then tries to link Second Life to crime.
What is going to be %100 missed is that Second Life is more of a simulator than anything. You don't go mindlessly beating monsters up simply because you need the EXP. I don't even think Second Life has a real levelling system.
This is like Mario Andretti criticising Live for Speed because of the unprofessional driving behavior of some of the players.
;p
Ha ha ha!
Well, that explains why they don't go after World of Warcraft!
Of course, WoW doesn't also attract some of the WORST human beings known to man as much as Second Life does, but that's another story altogether.
oh my, if there are teens spending days in front of a computer and nothing else and the parents are "helpless" to stop it...
who should be on "Dr." Phil? the teen or the parents?
Besides, so what if Dr Phil says it's bad? That doesn't make him right. I mean, even after the V-Tech incident, only a handful of idiots still think it's videogames. Most of us were more disgusted about Cho's Screenplays than worry about what game he plays.
It's only a REAL threat if a REAL professional says it is (ie. the NONE televised ones who are famous)
Are you worried about your complete lack of responsibility toward your child?
Are you that lazy that you can't go and talk to your child about their online habits and what they are doing?
Are you being prevented from disciplining your child and setting limits for their time spent on the computer?
Are you completely oblivious to parental controls, password protection, and other means of preventing your child from spending too much time online/seeing inappropriate material?
Are you happier to let a tv personality try and magically solve these problems which have been exacerbated by your failure as a parent?
Every single one of the concerns in the original solicitation can be addressed by parents directly, and should be, if they are in any way responsible. It's like that John Stewart parody of the politician: "And as I stand there...powerless to do anything...I ask myself...where has the system gone wrong?". It is up to parents to monitor their children's behaviour and curtail/restrict it if necessary. As I child I was allowed play video games, but not play them for hours upon hours. When it came time for homework/dinner/bed my parents said "Time to finish, save your game and switch it off" (they were lenient enough to let me reach save points :))
It is not the place of government, Dr Phil, Oprah, that miami dude, God, etc. to make sure your children do not develop unhealthy habits. It is up to their parents, and their parents only. Sure, people like teachers can help, but ultimately, responsibilty for children begins and ends with their parents.
@Bildo:
"Does he know that people have died due to WoW?!"
I hope you are being sarcastic here. No-one has ever died due to an MMO. People HAVE died due to neglecting themselves and others because they have allowed themselves to become addicted to MMOs, but not because of the MMO itself.
Your statement is like saying "people have died due to automobiles!" A car has never killed anyone. Certainly, people have been killed due to driving while drunk, driving recklessly, speeding, lack of attention, but these deaths are a result of human behaviour, not due to the cars or the basic activity of driving.
Thought it shouldn't come as any suprise, but this episode is clearly just going to be a witch hunt designed to get ratings.
And yet Dr. Phil has the brass balls to claim he is a scinetist.
I loathed Dr. Phil long before he decided to weigh in on video games, and this just inflames my desire to grab a whiffle bat and go to town on the guy. The thing he conveniently doesn't bother mentioning is that, according to Linden Labs' own policies, you have to be 18 in the first place to even set up a free account.
@KitsuFox:
SL doesn't have an inherent level-up system, no, but there's more than a few independently-produced combat systems floating around to compensate for that, my favorites being RCS, DCS2 and the Samurai Island combat system. Most roleplaying (including combat) in SL is done in text form. It can be pretty fun, if you're into actual roleplaying instead of grinding.
However, I do take issue with the frequently brought up topic of whether or not online games kill/destroy peoples' lives. I'm sorry, but if you lack the basic instincts and/or common sense to take a break for food, or leave your infant in the tub with the water running (I seem to recall something like this being blamed on Everquest), that's not the game's fault-- it's you being a moron.
If a kid is spending days at a time in front of a computer screen and making money, how is he any worse than most white collar workers who go to work and stare at a screen for 8+hours per day?
A parent who would be upset at this is an idiot, especially if the kid is having fun AND making decent cash
They don't believe in The Truth, The WHOLE Truth, and Nothing But The Truth.
In fact, they feed off the lack of such an idea. Misinform the public, spread panic, lie, deceive, incite riots (whether they are verbal protests or physical altercations), and so on. Whether their motivation is glory and attention or pushing one's personal, religious, and/or political beliefs on other individuals and/or Parents, it still amounts to the same thing.
That's pretty much the direction most talk shows took over the last couple of decades. Nothing intelligent or factual can be gleaned from such shows and rest assure, there will be clear bias on the part of the "host".
Nightwng2000
NW2K Software
Course that is just how it goes when you're going around repairing peoples computers for twelve+ hours a day.
STOP BRAKZING TEH FXING COMPUTERS!
I want to sleep.
Is it just me? Do I not understand it? AM I MISSING SOMETHING?
No good could possibly come of this. What kind of /b/tard* thinks of thierself as an SL addict anyway?
*Answered my own question.
By the way, I'm taking the deposition Tuesday of Alabama Judge Moore, the one who improperly yanked my pro hac vice admission in our GTA case. This should be great fun. Full report here at GP when I have it.
Once you learn basic scripting and building, well, it can get pretty fun just seeing what's possible.
@xzero87
Actually, being able to make a building pop outo f thin air a, flitting around the sky like superman, or being able to have your avatar look like anything you want doesn't sound all that real life to me.
@Zigs
Let me guess, a game has to be uber realistic to your standards to be worth anything.
Aww, you're adorable. "uber realistic"? I don't think there is a single game available that I would qualify as "uber realistic". In point of fact I'm one of 'those people' that thinks the whole 3D trend is in place to inflate the market value by simplifying the product to appeal to the great unwashed. Or, I think games are getting more retarded so more retards will buy them. So I guess that would make me anti-"uber realistic," huh?
I am against games where someone might try to stick his furry little raccoon cock in me. Let's not forget that there is a such thing as SL rape. Moreover than that, I don't want to play a non-game where you wander around looking at massive amounts of shitty code produced by the great unwashed.
How about a transcript? (just to be fair & balanced, as they say)
For what, your lil' federal lawsuits that are headed toward dismissal? Good luck with that.
This time it actually took 6 lines. I thought it was a real post until then.
Degrade them in front of millions,
Make all the Soccer Moms begin ranting on the "evils of society",
and generally be an ass, for reasons only known to "Dr." Phil.
Oh, and Jack, maybe he was IN A MEETING, and you were calling like an angry spouse?
Am I missing something? I didn't read any comments linking SL to crime.
Well answer your fuckin' phone then! Haha
@Jack-be-nimble
So the Alabama case is going to get dropped; I wonder, did anybody question your credibility this time around?
Uh huh, right, let us know how hard that fails.
@Zigs
I've not witnessed one rape thing on there, but then again I don't travel to areas that allow it.
I happen to be a furry on there by the way, my avatar is fairly well made if I do say so myself, you jsutn eed ot look for anything that is decently made by your standards.
Watch dude, he will conveniently forget that transcript.
Do you set yourself up to fail? Or do you just suck at being a lawyer?
Now, I have no law degree, and I can tell you that its a bad idea to fuck with a judge who has already had enough of your crap.
Aw, are you lonely Jack? Do you want Dennis to call you and keep you company. Seriously your man-crush on Dennis is becoming creepy.
Have you considered, maybe for a second, that Dennis might not want to call you, or return any of your numerous creepy answering machine messages, because you are a flaming asshole?
Hey Jack, actually you should get your own tv show where your a lawyer working at defeating some 'evil' and fail humorously each and every time. Maybe then you might actually succeed in defeating the Gamer race.
Look, Doris, I don't care what sort of half human/half animal w/realistic genitalia you role play or how pretty you think it looks. It's the Myspace factor, stupid people write shitty code that makes it on to my monitor and my eyes start to bleed profusely. Not that I'm against people who code their own stuff, It just has to not look like someone's dirty, donkey dick filled ass. I think being a furry is a social dysfunction. Second Life is a haven for furries, ergo I do not like Second Life. Oh and I know the rape case was covered here, but I can't find the article.
Amid claims (valid or not) that GP is rather biased (personally, I don't believe it and I am capable of looking elsewhere for additional info when needed or wanted, but I'm not the only person reading this site), I thought, why not have a segment, maybe once or twice a week as needed, with a "The Other Side" article written by various personages from, obviously, the other side.
Yes, I know, if "the other side" really wants to have headlines, they really should start their own blogs/websites. But, I'm also not suggesting that all the articles be written by one person.
Positive: They get to write their own article, have their say, and we get to, as with all other articles, have that interactive ability to comment back in a more controlled way. In other words, not having them write random jibes in some other article that has nothing to do with what they are writing about. It would be less chaotic.
Negative: Potential complaints that "I wrote an article but it wasn't posted" when they never really did write the article they claim to have written. Or, someone writes a self-serving article solely for chest beating, which could just as easily be shoved into an OT forum.
Their articles may contain misinformation, lies, and deceit, but, hey, that's what makes the Interactive News Media so wonderful: COMMENTS!
Of course, this is merely a wild suggestion and I don't expect it would happen. Too many folks think the other side should just shut up altogether. And some folks on the other side would whine that they wouldn't get paid, so they won't do it. Personally, I like it, but hey, who am I? Besides, I seem to have a vague recollection that this may have been suggested before and it didn't work out. But I can't be sure.
Nightwng2000
NW2K software
I think that would be the kindling for a never ending flame war. Sort of like what's going on right now between Johnny Bruce and the rest of the site.
Well, it might keep some folks warm at Christmans. :)
Nightwng2000
NW2K Software
He'll always be a form of entertainment. The only difference will be he won't be going through as many legal channels. Well, most likely at least. I will always give the man respect for one thing though: as far as I can tell, he's acting on his beliefs. No matter what we may think of them.
I really am curious as to why Dr. Phil chose SL. The last numbers I saw, a couple of days ago, it had 1.2 million active players. What is WoW up to now? Is it 9 million or did it already pass that?
I can understand the focus on MMOs. I've had plenty of friends that have had problems. And I'm sure I'm not the only WoW player here who saw level 50+ blood elves like 3 days after the expansion came out. I guess it must be something about focus groups and ratings.
You don't even have to play that much* to get those results, it's more of a 'knowing how to maximize your grind' type of thing. As far as SL goes, I just don't see how a game based mostly around wandering around could be considered 'addictive' compared to a game like WoW that has over 60% of the market share.
*still playing quite a bit.
Dennis must have caller ID and is screening you.
Nobody wants to talk to you anymore...
I think they changed tack due to the following:
1) It's old. After Paducah, Columbine and dozens of other school shootings, people are tired of it and at this point are beginning to wonder if there might be other factors at play. The V-Tech shootings were pretty much proof of that as the media largely rejected those theories; especially after it was discovered Cho didn't play video games at all.
2) After dozens of studies whose results were inconclusive at best, they probably didn't want to base it on such shaky ground. Even though Dr. Phil's show may be the usual daytime garbage, they seem to got to better lengths than most to appear professional avoid overt sesnationalism.
3) After having contacted JT and doing some research on him, they probably realized how full of shit he was and that's when they decided to go in another direction.