Australian Attorney General Shouted Down Over R18+ Rating Issue
Australian Attorney General Shouted Down Over R18+ Rating Issue
March 10, 2008
Recently GamePolitics reported on a move to create an R18+ rating for video games in Australia.
The idea is popular among Aussie gamers since adding the new classification would offer grownup consumers additional gaming choices. A number of titles which qualified for sale in the U.S. market, for example, were banned Down Under because they failed to meet the mark for Australia's current highest rating, M15+. These include Marc Ecko's Getting Up: Contents Under Pressure, 50 cent: Bulletproof and Blitz: The League.
Predictably, not everyone in Australian politics agrees with the proposed change. But, as reported by news.com.au, South Australian Attorney-General Michael Atkinson (left) was shouted down in Parliament last week while arguing against adoption of the R18+ rating:
Mr Atkinson is the most vocal opponent to a R18+ classification for games... During the speech, Mr Atkinson began to describe five games that had been banned in Australia. As he was describing drug use in the game Narc, he was cut off by raucous interjections and returned to his seat.
The text of Atkinson's speech explains his objections (it's about the children!), and includes the following:
I do not want children to be able to get their hands on R18+ games easily. I understand that the lack of an R18+ classification denies some adults the chance to play some games, however, the need to keep potentially harmful material away from children is far more important...
Proponents for the classification say the latest technology allows gaming platforms and computers to be programmed to allow parental locks. Today’s children are far more technologically savvy than their parents. It’s laughable to suggest that they couldn’t find ways around parental locks if R18+ games were in the home...
I contest any idea that it is necessary for games to include material of this kind and that a game is more interesting to an adult because it contains extreme violence, explicit sexual material, instruction in crime or characters using illicit drugs...
GP: Unfortunately, we don't have any news on which members of Parliament interrupted Atkinson's speech or why they did so...
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Posted 11/08/09 at 01:07am
Austin_Lewis: Health insurance, brought to you by the same kind of bureacrats who couldn't, in timely fashion, investigate the comments of any of the men Obama appointed Czars. Or their past. Or their history of not paying taxes.
Austin_Lewis: Health insurance, brought to you by the same kind of bureacrats who couldn't, in timely fashion, investigate the comments of any of the men Obama appointed Czars. Or their past. Or their history of not paying taxes.
Posted 11/08/09 at 01:06am
Austin_Lewis: Yes, and what a piece of crap it was. Arresting and fining people just because they don't make a personal choice to buy healh insurance, creating over a hundred new bureacracies, and worse.
Austin_Lewis: Yes, and what a piece of crap it was. Arresting and fining people just because they don't make a personal choice to buy healh insurance, creating over a hundred new bureacracies, and worse.
Posted 11/08/09 at 12:24am
ZippyDSMlee: JDKJ:the only trouble is a bunch of witless hacks wrote it....its going to be a train wreck....
ZippyDSMlee: JDKJ:the only trouble is a bunch of witless hacks wrote it....its going to be a train wreck....
Posted 11/07/09 at 11:33pm
JDKJ: BREAKING: In a photo-finish at the wire, House passes health care reform bill. Relatedly, in a fit of pique, Austin Lewis kicks innocent dog.
JDKJ: BREAKING: In a photo-finish at the wire, House passes health care reform bill. Relatedly, in a fit of pique, Austin Lewis kicks innocent dog.
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:27pm
ZippyDSMlee: man I got alot of junk and dup files too >< god I need orginization...and no not the knee capping media mafia kind :P
ZippyDSMlee: man I got alot of junk and dup files too >< god I need orginization...and no not the knee capping media mafia kind :P
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:26pm
ZippyDSMlee: replaced :P
ZippyDSMlee: replaced :P
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:23pm
ZippyDSMlee: beemoh:hey its like 60GB porn,400GB anime 100GB games and crap I have took from all my DVDs, I hate waiting on dvds to install stuff..... oh and 40GB of my porn was in the found.000 folder...mostly corrupted.... least I got names of wut needs to be repa
ZippyDSMlee: beemoh:hey its like 60GB porn,400GB anime 100GB games and crap I have took from all my DVDs, I hate waiting on dvds to install stuff..... oh and 40GB of my porn was in the found.000 folder...mostly corrupted.... least I got names of wut needs to be repa
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:18pm
beemoh: @Zip: ...and you'd have to spend all that time re-downloading that porn?
beemoh: @Zip: ...and you'd have to spend all that time re-downloading that porn?
Posted 11/07/09 at 03:34pm
ZippyDSMlee: ggrrrrr......vista lost one of my hard drives and I had a heart attack thinking I lost 1TB of data....
ZippyDSMlee: ggrrrrr......vista lost one of my hard drives and I had a heart attack thinking I lost 1TB of data....
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:58am
JDKJ: Which could be explained by both (a) and (b).
JDKJ: Which could be explained by both (a) and (b).
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:56am
Austin_Lewis: JDKJ: You forgot C) the fact that, for some reason, every time he did something that would suggest he shouldn't be in the military, let alone an officer, higher ups ignored it or let it slide.
Austin_Lewis: JDKJ: You forgot C) the fact that, for some reason, every time he did something that would suggest he shouldn't be in the military, let alone an officer, higher ups ignored it or let it slide.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:51am
JDKJ: Part of the problem is, I believe, that (a) the Army had a lot of time and money already invested in him and which they were unwilling to simply write-off and (b) an increasing need for the type of skills and services he provided.
JDKJ: Part of the problem is, I believe, that (a) the Army had a lot of time and money already invested in him and which they were unwilling to simply write-off and (b) an increasing need for the type of skills and services he provided.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:48am
JDKJ: And that even if he was begging not to get cut loose, he was apparently a real good candidate for being cut loose, anyway.
JDKJ: And that even if he was begging not to get cut loose, he was apparently a real good candidate for being cut loose, anyway.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:11am
JDKJ: @chada: And while Kennedy once noted that there's usually more than enough blame for everyone to get a slice, the possibility that the Army was unwilling to cut loose someone who was asking to get cut loose could be a factor.
JDKJ: @chada: And while Kennedy once noted that there's usually more than enough blame for everyone to get a slice, the possibility that the Army was unwilling to cut loose someone who was asking to get cut loose could be a factor.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:07am
ZippyDSMlee: *noms on his feet*..nomnomnomnom*droooll* ...wuuutttttt uuu looking at?
ZippyDSMlee: *noms on his feet*..nomnomnomnom*droooll* ...wuuutttttt uuu looking at?
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:05am
JDKJ: I'm no psychologist, but I'm told that crazy people have a tendency to do crazy things.
JDKJ: I'm no psychologist, but I'm told that crazy people have a tendency to do crazy things.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:03am
chadachada321: Whoops, was out of the convo for awhile. I do wonder what type of ammo he used etc, but the real issue is WHY he did it, not HOW
chadachada321: Whoops, was out of the convo for awhile. I do wonder what type of ammo he used etc, but the real issue is WHY he did it, not HOW
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:56am
JDKJ: But if it turns out that they actually did, they'll have Hell to pay.
JDKJ: But if it turns out that they actually did, they'll have Hell to pay.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:45am
JDKJ: And I'd tend to rule out the possibilty of FN Herstal supplying restricted ammunition to someone merely because they're ordering it from a military base.
JDKJ: And I'd tend to rule out the possibilty of FN Herstal supplying restricted ammunition to someone merely because they're ordering it from a military base.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:37am
JDKJ: I know you don't leave your gated community and get around much in dark alleys, so you may be surprised to learn that there's this thing called "the black market" where, if you've got enough money, ain't too much of anything which can't be bought.
JDKJ: I know you don't leave your gated community and get around much in dark alleys, so you may be surprised to learn that there's this thing called "the black market" where, if you've got enough money, ain't too much of anything which can't be bought.
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Comments
If they are appointed, threaten the politician doing the appointing. Threaten them with being voted out of office unless they appoint a better AG.
That is what I like about politics, if you don't like it, there is a way to change things.
@ some guy: You hit the nail on the head, squire. Here are your complimentary 10 points.
good to see him pwned
Idiot
For the umpteenth time, this is the parent's responsibility!
don't bother pointing it out, if you try to burst their bubble they will attack our culture at large for it...
Now we'll NEVER get the R18 rating. NEVER
Good job Ausfailia.
Rrrrrright.....
Fixed.
It could be a very good sign indeed, if he was shouted down because the people doing so disagreed with him.
Unfortunately, it could also be because they just don't consider it important at all.
I'll use the PS2 controls as an example, as it's the only control I'm familiar with. For those who don't know, it works by the parent setting a rating level; playing a disc with a level higher than the set level requires putting in a 4-digit PIN.
1) Breaking a 4-digit number isn't trivial. Your kid could of course watch you put it in, but then you're an idiot for not guarding your number. Kids can also use a universal bypass, but they may not think of looking for such a thing. Plus...
2) It's not easy to bypass the code without leaving evidence somewhere. The universal bypass makes you change the code, something the parent will notice next time they try to enter it.
3) You can't make un-bypassable controls, just like there is no unbreakable security system. Both simply make it much harder to get restricted access. Weighed against the risks of attempting bypass, a lot of people would sooner not try it in the first place.
18-year-olds are in most jurisdictions considered adults after all.
When it comes to Parental Controls...
I AM THE PARENTAL CONTROL BECAUSE I AM AN ADULT GAMER WHO KNOWS ABOUT THIS...
Sorry for blurting that one out,
It is good to have parental controls, sadly my dad still had trouble with technology and it is only useful for parents who are gamers themselves to hook up the parental controls for their kids...
Also this guy is from the state government from South Australia...btw...
Won't happen if parents actually do their job. And jsut breeding doesn't make one a parent.
" I understand that the lack of an R18+ classification denies some adults the chance to play some games, however, the need to keep potentially harmful material away from children is far more important…
Proponents for the classification say the latest technology allows gaming platforms and computers to be programmed to allow parental locks. Today’s children are far more technologically savvy than their parents. It’s laughable to suggest that they couldn’t find ways around parental locks if R18+ games were in the home…"
SO perfectly responsible adults should be denied a right to choose because some little kid might, MIGHT do this? Oh sir, you under estimate how responsible people can be given the chance.
If protecting children is so important then by his rational plenty of films should also be banned for their adult content. After all it's just as easy, if not easier, for a child to pick up and watch an 18 cert film found in the house... and what about the internet? Should Australia ban home use of the web because children might access adult material on it?
Gift.
Right.....
Are the anti-game people in your country largely motivated by religion like they are in the USA?
While there are many, many ways of doing it, every single method leaves a trail that any parent who cared could follow easily.
And besides, if my kid haxored his 360 I'd be impressed :)
Ratings only tell you what to expect if you're conservative and unable to factor in that kids are a hell of a lot more intelligent than you give them credit for.
Never got an answer, but it's nice to see that they are actually going to do something about this. Would also like to know if they are going to end the ban on adult shops selling porn outside of the ACT.
DEATH TO ALL FORMS OF CENSORSHIP IN AUSTRALIA!
That's just it - we don't really have any anti-game people outside of the government. While they may be out there they certainly aren't as vocal as the ones in the States. People here are pretty reasonable when it comes to matters like this. I still contend the majority of opponents aren't motivated by religion but rather by a lack of social understanding and absolutely no way to cope realistically with new things (ie technology). My pastor plays Halo religiously (pun intended) and I make a living developing games. If something was awry with that we'd be the first to know. The beauty of our parliament is that occasionally somebody will say something stupid, as is the case here, and they'll pretty much get called a wanker. Don't expect this objection to do anything but bolster the case FOR the new rating. When we can drop f-bombs at anytime of the day on national television any case for protecting the children Lovejoy style gets the boot...
Clever
PS: I'm so sure we have Bulletproof here because I saw it in the "50-Cent" bin at JBHi-Fi and quite literally lol'd....
Face facts, adults shouldn't be penalized for other people's inept parenting. Suck it up and learn how to protect your kids, and every politician in every government should back off.
"So are Australian AG’s appointed or are they elected?"
The AG is like the Minister for Law. They're a member of parliament in the Gov't party who is appointed to that position by the party leadership.
It isn't an independent position like the US AG is (or supposed to be). Just another front bencher who gets their talking points from the party/PM.
@ Zerodash
"Are the anti-game people in your country largely motivated by religion like they are in the USA?"
We don't have anything like Jack Thompson over here, but there is one Federal Senator from the 'Family First' who is the kind that would scream "Won't somebody think of the children?!" who would be against this issue, against porn and generally right-wing..
Not sure about the State Gov'ts.
If protecting children is so important then by his rational plenty of films should also be banned for their adult content. After all it’s just as easy, if not easier, for a child to pick up and watch an 18 cert film found in the house… and what about the internet? Should Australia ban home use of the web because children might access adult material on it?
THIS.
Just because one can use a computer does not give them an MIT degree (no matter what radio or tv commercial one might have seen).
I contest any idea that it is necessary for books to include material of this kind and that a book is more interesting to an adult because it contains extreme violence, explicit sexual material, instruction in crime or characters using illicit drugs…
Australia is funkled up....
I'm not sure how this would go down in Canada, our gov't relecently proposed a morality law that would give the goverment the right to cut funding to canadian flims that they deemed "imoral/smut/BAD!"... EVERYONE was against it, especially our famous media figures who report the news...
Actually that is 10,000 combinations. 0000 to 9999. Start at base zero.
My Mistake.
How do games NOT pass MA15+? There's a plus sign on the end, that means 15 (#) and up (+). Does Oz having a different idea about how a plus sign works?
Screw you.
Parents that care DO exist and parents that care AND are tech-savvy DO exist.
From a 13-year old Australian gamer,
Harry Miste.
Because a game rated 15+ can still be played by 15 year olds. The plus sign is just there to say that the game is suitable for persons aged 15 and over. Which is retarded. It's not like they're going to make a rating that's okay for 40 year olds but not okay for 50 year olds. But yeah, a game fails to pass 15+ when it is deemed not suitable for 15 year olds.
For example, the government's free internet filter (for protecting ze children) released last year was initially downloaded by ~60,000 iirc but the number of people still updating it has dropped to just under 7,000. Out of a population of 22 odd million.
This guy is the only AG blocking this move. At best he represents the residents of the state he was elected in (South Australia) while 5 other states and 2 territories are arguing for an R18+ rating.
"It’s literally one guy representing an extremely small minority.
For example, the government’s free internet filter (for protecting ze children) released last year was initially downloaded by ~60,000 iirc but the number of people still updating it has dropped to just under 7,000. Out of a population of 22 odd million.
This guy is the only AG blocking this move. At best he represents the residents of the state he was elected in (South Australia) while 5 other states and 2 territories are arguing for an R18+ rating. "
It should be noticed that when I was trying to find a way to bypass it for a friend, I noticed that this site was blocked.
No points for guessing why nobody updates it.
Mark Twain said it best.
"Censorship is like saying a man can't eat a steak because a baby can't chew it."
BTW, Is there parental controls for the PS2? If so, I've never noticed.
Slap it on a T-shirt! That's the best quote ever!
Nah, our media is just desperate for something to fill slow news days and whilst the news is generally moderate and responsible, the current affairs shows have devolved from investigative journalism to tabloid rag in the last 10 years or so. That kind of show is now the perfect outlet for the "Society gone to the dogs" stories, so much so that a comedy show calld The Chaser's War On Everything kept a scoreboard of the 2 major current affairs shows & the story types they ran.
Atkinson was speaking in the South Australian state parliament.
'So are Australian AG’s appointed or are they elected? If they are elected, the people directly affected by the lack of an 18+ rating have some sway over this point. The threat of being voted out of office is a strong influence on policy decisions.'
A bit of both. All members of parliament are elected by the people (in this case, the people of South Australia) but who does what in the government is decided by the party itself. The people have no say who does what job in government, just who gets to have a seat there.
"On behalf on South Australia, I apologize for Mr Atkinsons actions."
Accepted. Though I'd rather see HIM apologise.
Would that mean many more games would be given an R18+ rating than they currently do? YES! But so what? In the US it's a problem, because companies like Walmart won't stock them. Here in Australia, that's not an issue. We don't have a major retail juggernaut like Walmart and most people got to gaming stores to fill their fix .... and I can't see EB, GAME, or any of the other major gaming retailers worry about checking ID for R18+ games 'cause they already do it for M15+ games.
Retailers: Hi how are you today. Looking to pick that one you today are you? Well, that's an +18 rated game; show me some I.D. Don't have it? Bad luck sorry you can't buy it then. Why can't you buy it? Because it's illegal for me to sell it to you without seeing your I.D. first, that's why... (end scene)
Did anybody else see what just happened then?
The ONLY thing we need, and i do stress ONLY: is to make it illegal to buy a game such as those with R+18 without proper identification - PROBLEM SOLVED
Now if the South Australian Attorney-General Michael Atkinson can't get THAT through his thick, out-dated skull, then i truly believe our efforts are doomed, as it could not be any simpler
- Aron Shick
First of all a lot of games Australia rates as M15 are classified as R18 in some other countrys that have an R rating Second its the parents job to make sure there children dont play games they think are inappropriate not MR government with a big R18 on the front cover parents will know that its not for children Aron Shick above has the perfect solution and finally if the adults are stupid enough to let there children play a game with ADULTS ONLY stamped on the cover then they have no excuse to bitch and moan about how there shouldnt be games like this there child can play