April 2, 2008
So, we're wondering if Nancy Carlsson-Paige will criticize the violence in The Bourne Conspiracy (screenshot at left) when it launches for PS3 and Xbox 360 in June.Carlsson-Paige, you see, is a Boston-area educator who has lectured and written on media violence for some time.
She's also the mother of actor Matt Damon, star of the popular - and violent - Bourne film trilogy.
In a chat session held on the Boston Globe's website, Carlsson-Paige addressed several game-related questions from readers:
c__Guest_: I won't let my son buy the game Halo for Xbox. I'm sure he plays it at friends houses, but am I a bad parent for being witholding like this? It appears to be violent and I'm a little uneasy about all of the shooting
Nancy_Carlsson-Paige: I am very wary of violent video games. Research shows they desensitize kids to violence, even more because they engage kids in committing violence. But if you can talk with your son, have honest dialogues about why you don't want him to play this game, that will help him understand more than if you simply forbid it...
Pam__Guest_: Do you think that the people who crave violence-watching are often those with a lack of a community of real people with whom they could demonstrate the power of brotherly love?
Nancy_Carlsson-Paige: Entertainment violence encourages people to be antisocial and promotes win/lose kinds of relationships. Maybe some people are drawn to violent entertainment because they are already somewhat isolated, but certainly watching it will make them more cut off from "brotherly love" as you say...
One chat room attendee challenged Carlsson-Paige on her son's own involvement with media violence:
Mark__Guest_: Nancy, your son is guilty of promoting violence and making hand guns look cool in his movies. He has also made millions of dollars doing this, what if any advice have you given him? Is it a matter of everyone is doing it, so should I. Or should he select roles where he's not shooting and killing everyone in his path?
Nancy_Carlsson-Paige: Adults have different views about violence in films... I believe there is way too much violence in films, promoted often by box office sales that rise the bloodier things get. Matt and I don't share the same views about violence in adult films, but we do see eye-to-eye on the importance of protecting children. We both support regulations to stop the marketing of violence in films to children through violent toys, products, and video games.
GP: It's too bad that no one asked Carlsson-Paige about the new Bourne game (which, by the way, remains unrated at this point)... Also, to be clear, we don't believe Matt Damon is involved in the game version.
Comments
specifically trained to ferret-out bullshit.
"What's that Gamer? A politician is lying to gain support from ignorant house-fraus? To the DAMON-mobile boy!"
Sure he cares
Seriously man, Matt Damon's mom???
Despite who they are all these media-will-cause-violence-among-youth experts are nothing more than ill informed.
I often forget that she's Matt Damon's mother. But after all, she's not her son's keeper.
which automatically makes anything she says questionable. Anderson has never found anything that didn't cause "aggression" and yet has never defined "aggression."
And all day I will have MATT DAAAAAMON from Team America running through my head.
BWWWAAAA?!?
Yes, it must be that we like video games because we can't find enough people to getogether a decent chorus of Kumbaya...
I've said it before and I'll say it again (and I've said that part before, too) desensitising someone to violence isn't ALWAYS a bad thing. I've seen EMT's that couldn't get desensitised and they just broke down. When FACED with violense, do you want your only option to be either locking up or fainting?
My wife hasn't played violent games, but I've drilled into her that if someone comes through the door and she is too far from the shotgun, anything with mass can be a weapon. Butter knife, desk lamp, naginata... and she is pretty handy with her set of Gil Hibben Throwers. Go for the eyes, the crotch, and the neck, in that order.
Maybe a bunch of elderly ladies sitting around eating their biscuits and drinking their tea don't have to worry about it, but we have gangs where I live. To each their own, but she needs to leave her each out of my own.
It's a transcript of CCFC's 4th summit, held in 2005. Excerpt :
"Video games are fast becoming a favorite activity outside of school for even young children, often replacing more creative and socially interactive forms of play. Many of the most popular video games, even those played by young children, are violent. A mother told me recently that her 8-year-old son was "suffering socially" because he didn't have video games at home. She finally bought him Pokemon, which she described to me as "very violent." She said her son now plays every day at home with his 5-year-old brother. This is a story I commonly hear from the parents I interview. They buy video games because of the peer pressure their children experience. And once the games enter the house, younger children are playing too."
----
Papa Midnight
WHAT THE HELL?
sO i GUSS HER SON KILLING PEOPLE WITH PENS AND SHIT IS PERFICTY FINE.
The letter was written and organized by the Campaign for a Commercial-Free Childhood (CCFC). This past summer, CCFC filed a complaint with the Federal Trade Commission that Transformers – rated PG-13 for “intense sequences of sci-fi action violence, brief sexual humor, and language – was being marketed extensively to preschool children through television advertising, food promotions and licensed toys. Last week, the FTC acted on CCFC’s complaint by urging the MPAA to adopt guidelines for the marketing of PG-13 movies.
“Transformers is just one of a string of violent, PG-13 movies marketed to preschoolers,” said CCFC’s co-founder and director, Dr. Susan Linn. “For too long, the film industry has undermined its own rating system by bypassing parents to target young children directly with marketing for films that the industry itself has determined warrant parental caution.”
Between May 2006 and June 2007, the Children’s Advertising Review Unit (CARU) publicly cited seven instances of PG-13 movies being advertised during children’s television programming. In 2007, Spiderman 3, Pirates of the Caribbean: At World’s End, and The Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer featured licensed toys for children as young as four. In 2005, the PG-13 blockbuster Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith featured toys for young children as well as a Burger King toy giveaway and several other food promotions that clearly appealed to preschool children, despite George Lucas’ public statements that the film’s violence and dark themes were inappropriate for children under six.
Tim Winter, President of the Parents Television Council said the PTC signed the letter to “send a message to the motion picture industry. If the MPAA wants their ratings to mean anything, they must stop the hypocrisy of marketing potentially harmful violent and sexual themes to children while claiming to protect children with mature ratings.”
“It is distressing that the industry response to parental concerns about media content is almost always to place the full burden on parents,” said Cheryl Leanza of Office of Communication of the United Church of Christ, Inc., a signatory to the letter. “These industry members essentially offer parents a Hobson’s choice: either expose your children to content that you find unacceptable, or withdraw your children from popular culture. This serves no one. We all benefit with more mutual communication and understanding, not less.”
Added Dr. Linn, “Given the film industry’s consistent failure to respect parents as gatekeepers, it is disappointing that the FTC chose to rely on self-regulation rather than taking action. We urge the MPAA to use this reprieve to institute a policy insuring that PG-13 movies are marketed in a manner consistent with their rating.”
The complete text of the letter to the MPAA can be found at http://commercialfreechildhood.org/mpaaletter.pdf.
The FTC's recommendation can be found at http://commercialfreechildhood.org/ftcrecommendation.pdf
CCFC's original letter to the FTC can be found at http://commercialfreechildhood.org/pressreleases/transformersftcletter.pdf
That fucking does it.
I collected star war since I was 5. fuck them to hell.
Matt Damon 'rehearses' each scene in the Bourne series several times before filming take place, does that mean that if he is put in a situation in real life he is going to change into the movie-character like some kind of Super-hero? Of course not, he's Matt Damon, an actor first, and his character second, just as when you are playing Violent Video games, you are someone playing a game first, and some kind of Elf with a sword that no person of those physical dimensions should be capable of lifting only while you are playing the game.
That's in part, why I don't necessarily disagree with the concept that it takes a few minutes to get 'out of character' after playing a video game, I could well agree there's a lot of 'lad' ishness after a challenging game, just like in Football, Baseball or any other game, being on the winning team makes you beat your chest for a few minutes, but there's a difference between the adrenaline rush of 'Victory' and going out and mowing down your classmates in cold blood, I simply cannot see a causal link.
In her defence, she talks about society in general, which does seem, at least to me, not to have taken a violent turn, but taken a very defeatist one, we always expect the worst from ourselves, and then tend to make sure we deliver, the media doesn't help because it is far more interested in displaying the worst side of humanity than the best.
I suppose if people were to ask me 'would you prefer it if games like GTA and Manhunt had never been as popular as they were?' then my reply would be 'Yes', but then, one of the main reasons that they are still popular is because of the people who dislike them continuously reminding us of their existence. Like Texas Chainsaw Massacre is not famous for being a good film, it isn't, it was gory, that was its selling point, but because of detractors, just about everyone has heard of it, same, I think, with GTA, had it not been for people keep pointing to it, it would have arrived, had its 15 minutes and vanished long ago.
The whole article is a barrel of laughable advice, especially this gem for a parent concerned about the Cartoon Network's Adult Swim block: "maybe look at the show together." Yeah, that plan is gonna go swimmingly. She keeps admitting that she's not familiar with the media that people ask her about, and while her honesty is refreshing, I keep wondering how credible she can really be if she hasn't done the research.
Fangamer
You just can't diss star wars infront of me.
No, he hasn't touched the game. Something to do with Legalities.
They'll just say it's because.. Is it inspired by the books or the film?
Maaaaaatt Daaamooon.
"But if you can talk with your son, have honest dialogues about why you don’t want him to play this game, that will help him understand more than if you simply forbid it…"
This is something most anti-game types wouldn't even *consider* doing.
I'm going to pull this quote out everytime I need something to show how alarmist some of these 'experts' can be. If Pokemon is violent, I wonder whether any of these people have ever been outside their front door into the real world.
Correct, the game does not use Damon's likeness or voice.
Andrew Eisen
Wow... Is she actually complaining that parents should, oh I don't know, take responsibility? It is, after all, the parents responsibility to monitor what their kids take in and/or understand what they're seeing on television and other forms of media. It's sad and distressing to see someone openly complaining about parents being required to take responsibility for their children.
Except what you want is "restrict all content you find unacceptable, even for other parents who might not find it so".
Why is that so hard to understand for some people?
....It's called 'friendly competition.' What's next, keeping kids from playing sports in school?
This kind of thinking is a couple stones-throw away from all the needless rules in schools to minimize contact between students. Anti-hugging rules come to mind. (Though certainly not limited to it, of course. Lack of recess is another for the younger grades)
"Maybe some people are drawn to violent entertainment because they are already somewhat isolated, but certainly watching it will make them more cut off from “brotherly love” as you say…"
If your children are so consumed by the entertainment that it's the ONLY thing on their mind, maybe. However, in the REAL world, they talk about more than just one thing all day long. They exchange many subjects. A-doy.
"I am very wary of violent video games. Research shows they desensitize kids to violence, even more because they engage kids in committing violence."
In other words, she's familiar with the JT/Yee/extremist spin on the subject. At least attempt to SITE the source. Geez.
I like how she dodged that last question and basically went "Adults are smart, kids are not. PROTECT TEH CHILDZ. MAGIC 18 BALL."
DITTO (no pun intended)
That's just plain.... how is Pokemon violent?? It's one-framed 2D sprites spewing water across the screen. Flashing. Fainting.
Just..... no. Just no.
Pokemon very violent? OMFG I LOLED SO HARD!!!! i won't say anything becasue the women can think what she wants. but honestly. if i thought my child had a mental problem leading to a merging of fantasy and reality i would rather have them playing the game at HOME instead of where i can't see or hear what is going on. honestly when i was young some of my friends parents would see that were were still alive every other day when they happened to see us in the hall or kitchen etc.
What? I don't even know how to respond to that. She is complaining about adults enjoying this game and her inability to tell a child no that is not for you? I honestly fail to see the issue. Parents have to determine what their child can or can not consume. It is the parents DUTY. Her statement is obviously reflective of a segment society that no longer wants to have the "burden" of parenting their children. Why should anyone else besides the parents be responsible for the parenting of that child. Why have children if you don't want to raise them? Doesn't that defeat the entire purpose? Why have a child you don't want to parent? I'm obviously missing something here. Here they are labeling us as evil and a menace to society and they don't even want to parent their own children they want us to help them.
I think people like her are the problem. If you have a child you are responsible for raising it yourself, with your partner or with your family. It is a family issue. Why should another party or in this case an industry of artists be responsible for the parenting of your child? They aren't. That is the parents job. End of story.
Agree completely-I wouldn't even care about what Damon himself had to say about games, since as far as I know he's never been involved in one (though if I'm wrong on that one I guess he might have something to say). As for his mom, she's entitled to her opinion as much as I am, but I have no more desire to listen to her than she has to listen to me.
Games aren't for kids, etc. etc.
And as someone noted above, a limited "desensitization" to violence may be a good thing...if someone comes at you with a knife and you're too shocked to react, the fight is already over. You lost. Personally, my parents made sure I had some self-defense training (I took martial arts for over 10 years), and I am extremely grateful for that. I intend to make sure, when I have kids, that they know how to protect themselves too. Violence exists, and not being aware of it does not protect you. You cannot pretend it out of the world-it does not work. So stop trying.
Exactly.
It's baffling that society has reached this point. The industry is not responsible for anything more than developing and marketing a product to consumers who, by the way, have the option of buying or NOT buying a product. Seriously, it shouldn't even be an issue. You don't want your child to play Halo? More power to you. The problem is that the same parents who complain about what their kids play are the ones the PURCHASED THE DAMN GAME TO BEGIN WITH! They had the option of using their discretion to buy or not to buy.
It is not the industries responsibility to make sure you parent your child appropriately. Speaking of Halo... The woman who is worried about her child playing it to begin with. I can semi-understand her concern about her son playing it at a friends house, however, it almost sounded like her son had a copy at home? If that is the case then how the hell did he get it? Maybe mommy wasn't paying attention when she went looking for a gift for junior.
Of course pokemon is violent! Cute fuzzy rodents hurl lightning at cute little turtles in gladiatorial death matches! WE MUST PROTEST.
/sarcasm
Seriously though. I hesitate to do so, but I'd use myself as an example as a point to refute the "video games = violence" theory. I've played Resident Evil, Halo, Call of Duty, Silent Hill, Grand Theft Auto, and just about every other violent game that supposedly causes violence.
Maybe I should play that Pokemon game. I bet that'd push me over the edge.
"She finally bought him Pokemon, which she described to me as “very violent.”"
Of course pokemon is violent! Cute fuzzy rodents hurl lightning at cute little turtles in gladiatorial death matches! WE MUST PROTEST.
/sarcasm
Seriously though. I hesitate to do so, but I'd use myself as an example as a point to refute the "video games = violence" theory. I've played Resident Evil, Halo, Call of Duty, Silent Hill, Grand Theft Auto, and just about every other violent game that supposedly causes violence.
Maybe I should play that Pokemon game. I bet that'd push me over the edge.
Dang, beat me to it! ("Maaaatttt Daaaamoooonnnnn!")
You and me both. I'm also a Pokemon fan. Have most of the games and more Pikachu items (both me and my wife) then most grown men would admit (I do a fair impression). And while I may not be able to name them all from memory, I can at least identify all 251 (ok, I liked the shows and the games, that's all!)
And when you call Pokemon "very violent" then I have to start asking you, do you know there is a war going on? Do you know what happens in a war? Have you ever seen football, soccer, rugby? Would you like to walk though some of the more dangerous areas of our cities? What do you determine as "violent"? What is your definition? Is conflict by its own nature violent? Is competition?
I knew an old lady who didn't like Pokemon because she felt that the shortened word Monster in its name was offensive, being defined as something horrible, evil, monsterous.
Basically, it's a changing of the guards. You have new concepts and ideals, and the older generation sits back in the plush chairs, puffing on a pipe or knitting and such, and they talk about how... [wobbly dream sequence transition]
"It wasn't like this back in my day, all this frippery about virtual this and that. I know what virtual means. It means it's not real, hurumph! By definition, why, it's fake. Quite right, quite right! See here. All these video games, not good for the younger generation. I've been around the corner a few time, I'd say, and I know what's what! Why, theywould be better off spending their time doing anything else, perhaps getting together for a rousing good chorus oor something. (You there, fetch me another spot of tea. That's a good girl.) You know, what we should do is take those things away from them. It'd be for their own good, really. I mean, they may think they are grown up, but you don't really see things clearly to you reach my age. It's our duty, our moral duty, of course, to see to it that they are ready. All these flibberty gidgets and such don't prepare them. Not for the real world out there. I mean, it's not as rough as when I was but a lad, but they just aren't ready for. Nope. Not... ready... at... all... zzzZZZzzz."
[End dream sequence]
Ahhh... good old fasioned English fake grandfather.
I forgot all about the "Maaatttt Dammmoooonnnn!" Part.
I was actaully think more along the lines of "FAG" (Film Actors Guild for those who haven't seen it)
"We'll read the news paper and then recite what we read like it was our opionions all along!"
So, umm, is all this "promoting" via the Bourne films causing lots of kiddies to volunteer for secret CIA assassin training programs then?
And handguns are already cool. One doesn't need Matt Damon to tell them that...
More violent than *most* games I play.
Even past the 'Bourne' series - I believe he was in Saving Private Ryan? That's one of the most violent movies I've yet to see - outside of slice and dice horror.
Not that I am complaining about the movies - but get real lady.
Holy crap... pokemon violent? Seriously!?
What the... how can... why does... GAH!
Simple Problems Complex Solutions? Nah, Simple Problems go ignored.
http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/chats/transcripts/040108_carlssonpaige/
a.k.a. Matt Damon´s Mom?
Come on! She wants to be considered like a serious professional using her son´s name? It´s that even ethical accepted?
Can we start a "Cooper Lawrence Attack" now?
I would have liked Andrew Bub, the gamerdad from gamingwithchildren (former gamerdad.com) to have been there to set the record straight.
He and the gamerdad site thinks that it is OK for some kids to play Halo 3, since the violence is mostly cartoony and you only kill space aliens.
I also think we all agree that some children should not be playing say Bioshock, Gears of War, Crysis or CoD4. However, it is the parents that decide what they want their children to see, play or watch. If the guest on the show don't want her son playing Halo 3, it is her decision. If amother decides to buy Pokemon for her 9-10 year old son and then let her 5 year old son play it together with him, it is just a case of bad parenting, imo.
The story raises a valid question about peer pressure, though. Many peope have not got the money to buy the newest games and as a result their children can be left of the social groups which can be devastating to a
child of say 9, 11 or even 15 years of age.
I actually agree in part with matt damon's mom. There is way too much violence in the media these days - from the newscast about a certain war to games about this was, to movies about this war. It seems that it is no longer enough to just show the introduction (or prelude?) to a very violent scene in which there will be blood and gore. You have to show the blood & gore as well. And in my opinion, this gets boring and tiring really really fast. Give me an old fashioned Hitchcock movie any time. Sometime's restrictions can make directors, both in movies and in games, more creative.