Wife of SOCOM Designer Talks Game Addiction on Dr. Phil
Wife of SOCOM Designer Talks Game Addiction on Dr. Phil
September 19, 2008
When we last heard Dr. Phil expound on games, he was drawing a connection between the violent variety and the Virginia Tech rampage.
The TV shrink is probing video games again for an episode to be aired in October. We know because Wendy Kays writes on her blog that she taped a Dr. Phil appearance to promote her new book Game Widow, a self-help manual of sorts for those with game-addicted loved ones. Wendy, by the way, is married to Graham Kays, lead designer for SOCOM: US Navy Seals.
Here's Wendy's description of her Dr. Phil experience:
This week I had the delightful experience of being accused of bias towards the game industry by Dr. Phil. I’ve been accused often of bias against the industry, but never towards it! I’m over the moon…usually the media positions my game designer husband and I, his game widow, as enemies; and expect my book, Game Widow, to be anti-gaming. This is the first time I’ve been told I’m defending my husband and his job out of love. Fabulous! I’m going to make sure my husband watches the episode when it airs in the first part of October…he’ll get a huge kick out of it.
The question at hand at the Dr. Phil Show taping was whether the video game industry makes games addictive on purpose. I can't tell you anything about the show due to contracts signed, but I will say here there is no question in my mind that video games are addictive, or that they are designed to be highly attractive. Those two points I know for sure. I’ve personally lived through both the addiction of a family member to substance abuse, and video game abuse. There are no differences in the experience...
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Posted 07/04/09 at 08:20pm
GoodRobotUs: Went out for my Mum's 65th Birthday, which is the only relevance 4/7 has in the UK for me ;)
GoodRobotUs: Went out for my Mum's 65th Birthday, which is the only relevance 4/7 has in the UK for me ;)
Posted 07/04/09 at 08:18pm
Andrew Eisen: Beach + fireworks + root beer + strawberries, blackberries, raspberries, whipped topping, and pound cake = my Fourth of July!
Andrew Eisen: Beach + fireworks + root beer + strawberries, blackberries, raspberries, whipped topping, and pound cake = my Fourth of July!
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:58pm
GoodRobotUs: Which seems to be the only point Jack proved, that some people find some games offensive. i.e. Nothing.
GoodRobotUs: Which seems to be the only point Jack proved, that some people find some games offensive. i.e. Nothing.
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:57pm
GoodRobotUs: The discussion was supposed to be whether games were dangerous not 'Do you find some games offensive'...
GoodRobotUs: The discussion was supposed to be whether games were dangerous not 'Do you find some games offensive'...
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:55pm
GoodRobotUs: Some agreed, some didn't, but it was their choice to make, not the governments.
GoodRobotUs: Some agreed, some didn't, but it was their choice to make, not the governments.
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:55pm
GoodRobotUs: By asking the audience their opinion, he more or less proved that it's a matter of personal choice
GoodRobotUs: By asking the audience their opinion, he more or less proved that it's a matter of personal choice
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:55pm
GoodRobotUs: Meh, he ended proving Mark's point for him
GoodRobotUs: Meh, he ended proving Mark's point for him
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:26pm
Erik: Jack if you are reading this you are a LIAR. There is no legal weight to the MPAA's ratings.
Erik: Jack if you are reading this you are a LIAR. There is no legal weight to the MPAA's ratings.
Posted 07/04/09 at 07:24pm
JDKJ: I still think my buddy the midget who rides a unicycle backwards while juggling four bowling pins would have been a much bigger hit with that crowd. And he can make up statistics and misinterpret studies, too.
JDKJ: I still think my buddy the midget who rides a unicycle backwards while juggling four bowling pins would have been a much bigger hit with that crowd. And he can make up statistics and misinterpret studies, too.
Posted 07/04/09 at 06:33pm
Alyric: Of course, Mark falls into the common trap about Columbine, which had nothing to do with bullying, etc. See: http://slate.msn.com/id/2099203/?GT1=3256 for a more thorough explanation.
Alyric: Of course, Mark falls into the common trap about Columbine, which had nothing to do with bullying, etc. See: http://slate.msn.com/id/2099203/?GT1=3256 for a more thorough explanation.
Posted 07/04/09 at 06:32pm
PHX Corp: Read this http://www.destructoid.com/sgc-09-liveblogging-the-jack-thompson-debate-138502.phtml#ext
PHX Corp: Read this http://www.destructoid.com/sgc-09-liveblogging-the-jack-thompson-debate-138502.phtml#ext
Posted 07/04/09 at 05:54pm
PHX Corp: JT is afraid of such ban then advocates it That's what i call a total Hypocrite
PHX Corp: JT is afraid of such ban then advocates it That's what i call a total Hypocrite
Posted 07/04/09 at 05:50pm
PHX Corp: AE: JT is a -Bleeping- Jackass
PHX Corp: AE: JT is a -Bleeping- Jackass
Posted 07/04/09 at 05:07pm
Andrew Eisen: JT "knew it would be a good audience." Not what he said on Tuesday.
Andrew Eisen: JT "knew it would be a good audience." Not what he said on Tuesday.
Posted 07/04/09 at 05:01pm
Andrew Eisen: VG cause violent behavior. VG companies influence behavior to get sales. Yeah, that makes sense. (To be fair, the Twitter feed makes deciphering JT's point pretty tough.)
Andrew Eisen: VG cause violent behavior. VG companies influence behavior to get sales. Yeah, that makes sense. (To be fair, the Twitter feed makes deciphering JT's point pretty tough.)
Posted 07/04/09 at 04:52pm
Andrew Eisen: Yes, it's been proposed but as far as I know it has not been passed. Big difference.
Andrew Eisen: Yes, it's been proposed but as far as I know it has not been passed. Big difference.
Posted 07/04/09 at 04:50pm
Cheater87: http://www.gamezine.co.uk/news/formats/xbox360/all-violent-video-games-be-banned-in-germany-$1301757.htm
Cheater87: http://www.gamezine.co.uk/news/formats/xbox360/all-violent-video-games-be-banned-in-germany-$1301757.htm
Posted 07/04/09 at 04:49pm
Andrew Eisen: Far as I know, Germany has not banned all violent video games.
Andrew Eisen: Far as I know, Germany has not banned all violent video games.
Posted 07/04/09 at 04:44pm
Cheater87: Jack wants the US to follow Germany's total video game ban.
Cheater87: Jack wants the US to follow Germany's total video game ban.
Posted 07/04/09 at 04:42pm
Andrew Eisen: Note to JT, it is not illegal to sell kids a ticket to R-rated movies.
Andrew Eisen: Note to JT, it is not illegal to sell kids a ticket to R-rated movies.
Copyright © 2007 ECA. All rights reserved.
Game Politics and Game Politics logo are trademarks of the ECA.
Game Politics and Game Politics logo are trademarks of the ECA.
Comments
"I’ve personally lived through both the addiction of a family member to substance abuse, and video game abuse. There are no differences in the experience..."
Sometimes it's really difficult to refrain from calling someone an idiot.
I just can't help thinking off those poor girls working the street to try and do enough tricks to afford their next video game fix.
Shes right. There is no difference.
In both cases the root of their "addcition" is that of self control issues, escapism, and irresponcibilty. There is no problem with drugs OR video games. People are the problem.
Thats what I told the police when they caught me with meth, but they didnt buy it...
Generally, cops don't buy illegal subsatnces unless a) they are performing a sting or b) they are crooked.
E. Zachary Knight
http://www.editorialgames.com
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
MySpace Page: http://www.myspace.com/okceca
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You are so clueless, it hurts me. Your familiarity with this subject is more tenuous than your familiarity with the dictionary. How does nicotine fit into your little model of addiction as irresponsibility? If an addict just TRIES hard enough, can they will their neuroreceptors to heal themselves? I suppose all the people who have died from their withdrawl were just bellyaching? Freaking ass.
While I do admit the person above is retarded, they have a psuedo valid point IF they switch the word "addiction" with "use". And, of course, saying that escapism is the root of their use is a grandiouse oversimplification, but well... nevermind. There really is no saving some of the ignorant out there.
The problem in such a case was that they started at all. Don't get me wrong, to a degree I feel bad for chemical addicts, but at the same time...it's still their fault for starting in the first place. So in essence, he is right, as they, at the time before it caused them physical problems, did not have the self-control necessary to stop themselves. In this day and age the knowledge of whats good and bad for your body is pretty common.
Either way it's a matter of personal responsibility.
While I agree to a point, I do think that drugs can be used responsibly, in moderation, like anything. Gambling, drinking, smoking, drugs, all of that, as long as it isn't harming someone else and they are RESPONSIBLE about it, can be fine on occasion. That's my biggest problem with some laws these days, they are just blanket "this is illegal, no matter how much or little harm was done."
Except you know, the chemical addictions that some drugs cause, and the painful withdrawal symptoms.
Exactly. People need to show some restraint. The good news is video games are healthy, despite addictions. Drugs, on the other hand are debilitating, possibly lethal. People have died from drug abuse, or at least take years to recover from an addiction.
No one's died from games. Nor does it take a more than a little self-restraint to cut down from gaming 24/7 to a couple hours a day.
Not true, there are a few extreme cases of people dieing from gaming to the exclusion of all else. Such as a chinese man who logged into an internet cafe to play a game(maybe WoW, but not sure) and just kpt playing for days until he dropped dead.
But, yeah, in normal cases your point still stands.
God you're such a fucking idiot. Really addicted gamers could take awhile to recover, and people have died from extreme gaming before. Drugs are not completely bad, if used responsibly. Why is weed bad, exactly? Go ahead, why is it bad? As long as you use it responsibly, it can be a fun and great stress reliever. The only way it is bad is if people abuse it, like with drinking, or use it too much and become addicted to it. A non-addicted drug user can cut down his drug use, and a truly addicted gamer might need a lot more than "a little self-restraint" to cut down gaming time. It all comes down to responsibility.
Really addicted gamers could take awhile to recover, and people have died from EXTREME GAMING before.
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha! (Is in stitches)
"A non-addicted drug user can cut down his drug use, and a truly addicted gamer might need a lot more than "a little self-restraint" to cut down gaming time. It all comes down to responsibility."
What a dumb statement. Games don't cause permanent health ailments (gaining weight isn't permanent).
Weed? You smoke it incessantly and you're going to cause severe and permanent health problems (from the smoke itself). Many see it as a gateway drug to harder stuff that is most certainly many times more harmful than an addiction to videogames.
Both are not bad if used in moderation, but don't pretend one is easier to stop using than the other. It depends highly on the person.
In terms of video-game addiction, I think you'd have to have a really addictive personality to get to that stage. I have friends who play WoW for ridiculously long periods of time and they all have problems with drinking and smoking weed (16 year olds). It's kind of sad to see them self destructing, they don't turn up to school for 3-4 days at a time while they're playing or no one will hear from them for entire 6 week holidays. There's a rather obvious link here.
You mean, it was the video game that killed him, not the dehydration, starvation, or sleep deprivation?!?
There is a signifigant difference between the addictive nature of video games, gambling, etc. and the chemical addiction to drugs and other chemicals.
Drugs actually rewire the brain so that it no longer produces the chemicals needed for normal function, as the drug now supplies a fair approximation of the chemical (dopamine, for example). It doesn't matter why they started: friends pressured them into it, they were told its harmless, low self-esteem, escapism, etc. The fact is, that in many cases, once a person has tried a drug (cocaine for example) the brain immedeately gets thrown out of sorts and the person is physically and chemically dependant from that point on.
Video games are different. You aren't going to go into withdrawl convulsions because your friends made you go outside for a picnic and you can't be in your scheduled WoW raid. Video games are a choice every time. Drugs are only a choice the first time.
And yes, I see the apparent conflict between my screen name and my post. That name is more an affectionate reflection on my love for nautical and pirate history than my love for fremented sugar cane.
One-time use of cocaine does not result in addiction. Take an opiate for example, it opens a shitload of opiate receptors in the brain, then depleates them (due to the drug seeping out of your system), then fills them up again but not to the brim (the same dose, over time anyway. This is a terrible description of how addiction works, as it is quite complex, but my point still stands). The point is you need far more than one use of any drug (coke and opiates anyway) for physical addiction to occure in any noticable manner. As a secondary point, did you realize that only about 3/10 heroin users are junkies? That leaves a fair amount of people who are addicted and not trashing thier life due to the addiction, and another junk who use casually.
Perhaps you would like to tell me your source for that information? Mine is coming from Multiple journals from JAMA, AMA, and other smaller studies conducted in Ohio and John's Hopkins University (I am at work and don't have the specific study on hand).
People can and do (not every time, but a lot) become chemically and physically dependant from the first use of harder drugs, such as cocains and your beloved opiates. A number of people also die from that first usage as well. Look up SSD (Sudden Sniffing Death) and see for yourself.
Oh please... let me!
lets compare alcohol vs. world of warcraft.
25% of alcoholics will DIE during a "cold turkey" withdrawal without some kind of medical assistance. This is due to the extreme physical addiction of drugs that contain an "ethanol" pattern of dependence. They will have siezures/convulsions to the point where their heart gives out.
25% of raiders... don't. In fact stopping world of warcraft, no matter WHO you are, will NOT kill you. I'm not talking about "oh god i'm jonesin for a raid!". I'm talking about literal death.
Still not convinced? lets try nicotine vs. hell any video game
Nicotine is one of the most addicting substances on this planet. It's nigh impossible to quit without some kind of assistance. Before anyone says "people who can't quit smoking are weak minded" let me remind you that drugs effect the body differently for each person. It has both a physical (aproximately five days) AND psychological dependence (Usually drops off after a small length of time but lingers for as long as you are around smoking which is usually forever.)
While video games do have a psychological dependence, you are hardly going to experiance the same type of intensity as you are if you are trying to quit smoking.
I'm a student of addiction. In fact, I like to think it's my specialty. So, let me be among those that dismiss her insideous claim as ludicrous, retarded, and ignorant.
The man probably just replaced his addiction for using for video games. This means he got over the physical withdrawal but left the psychological addiction unchecked. Ever wonder why they have AA/NA meetings at least 5 days a week? A good number of people in AA/NA (which I am psuedo in favor of btw) replace their substance abuse for a dependence on those meetings. It's not video games that's the problem here. It's the fact you didn't address why they started using in the first place!!!!! Simpleton!!!
Nicotene has the same addictive hold that a like ammount of heroin has on the body. That is the main reason why it is so very addictive. (JAMA, AMA, Surgeon Gen reports 1965&1990).
(ranton) See guys, this is citation, you use it when stating a fact so as to establish the veracity and accuracy of said information. This seperates the blowhard posts from actual informative dialogue. (rantoff)
(ranton)Everything I said is factual. There is NO NEED to cite every piece of information I comment on this website. That's just anal... bling blong anal. I don't have to pull out a textbook/research article to prove what i've learned through personal experiance, over 36 hours of college classes, AND approximately four years of literature review. I don't know everything there is to know about addiction and there are people out there that know more than me, but I know enough to put together a thoughtful post on the subject. Grow up. (rantoff)
Or you could be talking out of your ass. Site your sources if you want to be taken seriously.
When people start paying me for comments I post on here, or give me class credit, then I will feel the need to site evidence that has been proven time and time again. The whole "cite or you're opinion is meaningless" is the most ridiculous pulling at straws "debate tactic" ever designed, especially on a blog.
If I get on the news ( very doubtful, practically nonexistant) i'll cite plenty of sources. If I write my own book (slightly less doubtful, but still very improbable) then i'll include hundreds of legitimate sources. If I write my own research article to be published (very probable due to pre existing degree requirements) then i'll include abundant resources. If I write a comment on game politics... sorry but I'm not. If you want to believe me then believe me. if you want to claim i'm full of garbage then you're free to do that, but talking to someone like a child because they don't cite every single argument they make is assinine.
Video games are no more addictive than fast food and sex, and this is true with any pleasurable activity which can become an addiction.
Yup. Anything good can be addictive. I think people tend to overstate addiction, making it into some kind of super-disease, when all it really is is a bad habit. Yeah, habits are hard to break, but most people have the fortitude to be able to break the habits that really get in the way of them living their lives. Some, however, don't. But either way, the focus of the habit (ie. the game, the drug, etc.) is not the problem. The true source of the problem is in the mind of the person who has the addiction.
You think our societal problems with hard drugs boil down to not enough willpower? I don't think you really know what you are talking about.
Our societal problems with hard drugs boil down to our war against them...
If we treated it like a health issue and not as the root of all evil, we wouldn't have a problem...
Check out this site to learn what the real problem is:(it is run by a group of about 10,000 law enforcment agents)
www.leap.cc
Yeah, i've dealt with those guys. I work in prevention and recovery.
These guys are blowhards that have zero refutable scientific data to back up their claims. They have created a causal link between the failure of the war on drugs (a policital blunder that is now institutionalized) and the relative harmlessness of drugs abuse that simply put, does not exist. Causation is not correlation.
No different than the sherriff JT loves to cart out when looking for validation.
so they have a causal link and no refutable evidence?
In those same words their evidence is irrefutable and they have proven a causation... seriously that is what you said...
Besides they aren't saying that drugs are harmless, they are saying that drugs should be a health issue and legal...
and that the horrible effects of drug abuse can be prevented for a lot more people that way... people wouldn't use deadly legal/illegal drugs if harmless ones were legal...
Oh and I think there is a slight difference between JT pulling out one sheriff and 10,000 law enforcement agents that are judges, corrections officers, cops, SWAT etc...
just look at the world, the tougther the drug laws, the more the drug abuse...
They use poor citation on their site and their theories are flatly turned down by the vast bulk of researchers and professionals who are dealing with those suffering the after effects of drug abuse. They are wrong and are relying on their implied authority as law enforcement officers to lend credibility to their arguments.
Look at the world, more poverty and less education equals more drug abuse. The only way that tougher drug laws create more abuse is by using draconian measures to incarcerate drug offenders and allow them to become even more addicted while inside. Drugs are dangerous and illegal and they will stay that way. If you want to help, then start contributing your time at clinics and in other volunteer grous aimed at helping to lift up those inder the thumb of substance abuse. Treat the illness, don't hide the symptoms.
I think our prison problem is from charging people for doing almost nothing. I think if someone wants to smoke weed, as long as it is done responsibly and in their own house or something like that (just like how it's illegal to be drunk in public), it should be fine.
You are not taking the stupid people into consideration. The ones that can not think for themselves. To them it is fully an addition, because they can't figure out how to pull away from it though they know it is wrong. While smarter people it is a habit, and you see there is something wrong, then you say, 'Okay, no games for 3 weeks.' Then you don't play them for 2 weeks, and you are like, yeah why was I doing that, I have better things to do.
Dr. Phil is an idiot to begin with. As someone with a high interest in psychology, I find horrible practices in his episodes that make me question how he has a license to practice in the first place. Yes, some people you have to berate to get them to realize what they need to do, but not every single freakin person...
This guy deserves to go back to the scum bucket he crawled out of... There is a great video of how his destroyed a town when he said he was going to help it. I can't find the video unluckily though...
This guy needs to disappear though. He is just another spawn from Oprah, and he needs to disappear back into her minge, and once that happens, Oprah's minge needs to suck in Oprah herself as if it was a black hole.
Becoming addicted to any pleasurable activity is rarely related to intelligence but rather emotional problems and issues.
Maybe you shouldn't shoot your mouth off on subjects you know nothing about, unless you want people to think you're stupid.
I think drawing a line between addictions that introduce a foreign chemical dependence and addictions that rely on triggering the brain to release naturally occuring chemicals at a higher rate is helpful.
A nicotine addict is introducing a foreign substance into their body and developing a physical dependence. A sex addict is stimulating the release of dopamine and other neurotransmitters that would already be there. Game addiction falls under the latter category--if at all--and there's considerable question as to whether people who have so-called dependencies to their own neurotransmitters are addicted in the first place.
Your logic fails with one crucial example. Opiates, more specifically heroin, morphine, and opium, stimulate the naturally occuring neurotransmitters that are called "endogenous opiods" which include endorphins, enkephalins, and dynorphin. Opiates bind to the same recepters that handle these endogenous opiods and create an immediate rush of euphoria, but eventually fades, and then their motives for using switches from "using to feel great" to "using to feel normal again". Of course, they aren't going to die from physical withdrawal, but it's going to be one hell of a ride.
Some of the worst kind of addictions involve naturally occuring neurotransmitters. There are others, that create hellacious physical/psychological dependence as well. The distinction doesn't really make sense, so extending it to umbrella video games is kind of a mute point.
Wow...and she wonders why the industry paints her as an enemy?
Addiction with video game is far more subjective than drugs. With video games, if you don't like something, you will stop playing it. Games will get old and people will move on.
With drugs, the drug itself never changes and neither do the effects. The dependency, on the other hand, increases with use and need becomes stronger.
Good point. Once you are addicted to something, it no longer matters whether or not you enjoy it. I hate smoking, for example. No one plays video games that they hate.
Yeah, my grandfather is addicted to smoking, so I only smoke cigars once ever few months during special events... (weddings, babies being born in the family, great new job, graduation, and so on)
Anonymous said: "No one plays video games that they hate."
That's not entirely true. I've known some EQ and WoW players who were no longer enjoying the game, but would not stop because they didn't want to flush all that time "invested" down the drain by quitting. For whatever reason, they apparently didn't consider the enjoyment they got from playing to be a fair exchange for their time and money...
You'll see these people on forums fairly often - they're burnout cases (IE, they didn't stop when it stopped being fun and relaxing, and kept playing until they came to outright HATE it), and are usually the most aggressive and vocal opponents of a game.
My problem is that people can become addicted to anything and everything, yet this lady seems to ignore that. Workaholics, Shopaholics, TVholics, etc. I have a friend who watches way to much tv, to the point that it isn't healthy.
The problem is a person's mental state. Or the addictive personality, or how we cope with real life.
She draws a connection with how videogames try to attract people, or please gamers, and addiction. Unfortunately addiction is more complicated than that. Any form of entertainment or business is going to try and attract shopers, buyers, viewers, etc. And there are going to be people who are going to unfortunately be attracted (extremely) to those things.
You do realize that slot machines and other electronic gambling machines are designed very deliberately to to set off every reward mechanism in your brain they can, even for the tiniest of rewards. They are designed to keep you playing.
MMO games have some very similar mechanisms.
True to a degree.
BUT, with gambling, the reward varies and the reward itself can be used for further rewards (more winnings, more stuff, bigger house, more stuff, etc). And loss can lead to other problems because if one gets in the hole, one must strive to "break even" or at least get out of the hole.
Video games, even MMOs, only have a dead end reward system. You win, even in part, and that's it. The physical reaction to the reward stops there (happy, excited, so on). You loose, you're depressed, must play more to win.
From the business aspect, gambling can garner larger and larger bets, or larger and larger losses.
But from the business of video games, even MMOs, the gain is steady and regular, only rising when new players join and continuing players pay a regular fee to play more. Their loss is a straightforward loss: No one buys the game to play, no new subscription, or players unsubscribe.
So the rewards for video gaming aren't the same as for gambling. And losses only come from excessive use, not from the risk of playing itself.
Nightwng2000
NW2K Software
Nightwng2000 has also updated his MySpace page: http://www.myspace.com/nightwing2000 Nightwng2000 is now admin to the group "Parents For Education, Not Legislation" on MySpace as http://groups.myspace.com/pfenl
Were that true then perhaps I could find a damn MMO I can play for more than 3 months. I WISH they had systems like that.
"I’ve personally lived through both the addiction of a family member to substance abuse, and video game abuse. There are no differences in the experience..."
Wow really?, thats a bit of a slap in the face for anyone who has lost a family member to substance abuse, when was the last time someone was found dead from a half-life overdose.
In this country? Not so much. But we've all read those articles about Asian gamers dropping dead from dehydration, malnutrition, etc.
Or worse, children suffering or dying from neglect while their parents are playing games.
Note that the blame for such things falls entirely on the players, not the game.
Mostly we hear about it from the state press.
Note that in both cases the games involved were MMOs. And usually when people talk about "games addiction" they are, in fact, referring to MMOs. I wish people would just specify instead of drawing video games as a whole into the WoW addiction phenomenon.
Wow, isn't your post a slap in the face to anyone who's had a friend or family member suffer from addiction, fatal or not. Get some perspective, just because someone hasn't died doesn't mean it is not destructive.
I think he's saying that comparing video game addicts to drug addicts trivializes the more serious problems that drugs create. The consequences of drug addiction and gaming addiction do not happen at a 1-to-1 ratio.
um in all fairness.. you cant really argue, SOME video games are made to be 'addictive' if you use the words in its casual sense rather than the medical term.
Take an MMO....
it is 100% made to be 'addictive' (in one sense), as customers need to keep playing to generate revenue.however.. i dunno.. id say there maybe too much of a blurring between the words 'addictive' and 'engrossing' both VERY similar things, but there is one key point to remember.
Being engrossed in something means you spend alot of time doing it, but an ADDICTION is something that INTERFERES with your everyday life in a DETRIMENTAL way. That is something that the GAMER is responsible for. We all are. I personally manage my time well, if i feel ive played too much, i stop for a while. Its up to ME to lok after myself, not somebody else. I take responsibility.
I would say though that , yeah, there are and ALWAYS WILL be players who are MEDICALLY addicted to games in the same way you can get addicted to anything, and it is detrimental in its effect. But thats typically not because of anyones 'fault'. Its Just that some people have personalities that mean they are easily addicted to things. And its up to that person to sort out the addiction.
Basically what im saying is i dont feel there is a conspiracy to make games have the same 'addiction' effect say as nicotine, i think its more a conspiracy to create an experience of 'enjoyment'. I think this is being misrepresented.
i think they are blurring the word 'addiction' used in a severe medical sense, and addiction when used in the casual sense of merely representing designers intention to provide a satisfying experience that keeps players .. playing.
Dont forget The ONLY options are
a) for gamers to take responsibility for themselves
or
b) for game companies to purposefully make games that gamers wont want to play ... which makes no sense as its commercial suicide.
Which option is fairer, and easier to do?
um in all fairness.. you cant really argue, SOME video games are made to be 'addictive' if you use the words in its casual sense rather than the medical term.
Take an MMO....
it is 100% made to be 'addictive' (in one sense), as customers need to keep playing to generate revenue.however.. i dunno.. id say there maybe too much of a blurring between the words 'addictive' and 'engrossing' both VERY similar things, but there is one key point to remember.
I don't know about that. It really depends on the person and their psychological makeup. Some pople just have a remarkable amount of willpower and can put something down even if they were into it heavily for a while. I played WoW fairly intensely for the first few years. These days, not so much unless my guild is planning a raid. If i want to get into it and do dailys for a time I can, but these days my time is spent playing other games like C&C 3 and Mass Effect.
By the same token, I have a friend who used to use drugs, and there was a time where she said she did Meth for a year, but was able to put it down and walk away from it as she told me it "wasn't [her] drug of choice." Now I suppose a large part of why she was able to quit so easily was because of the way she told me she took it; as she told me she would eat it rather than smoke it or inject it, which would severely diminish the effects. Still, I'd say that a lot of willpower was involved as well.
This, by the way, is the same friend who is/was on Morphine when she broke her back, but she seems to be handling that one ok too. Considering this is someone who would read things like the Physicians Desk Reference "just for fun," and knows a thing or two about pharmaceuticals, I'd be inclined to take her at her word when she tells me these things.
My ex girlfriend drinks semi regularly and still maintains a high 3.8 gpa, at 17 years old. It all comes down to the person and responsibility. I know that I couldn't handle drinking more than once a month without becoming obsessed, so I don't. Some people can take stuff and know when to quit, others don't. We shouldn't treat it like such a crime though, and should instead find the underlying causes and fix them.
Are films 'made' to be addictive? Is music 'made' to be addictive?
Yes, in exactly the same way that games are 'made' to be addictive.
There have been far more breakups of relationships through to 'TV Addiction' than video game addiction, yet no-one would consider saying that Movies etc are 'designed to be addictive', even though they are, especially series like the 'X-Files' which are deliberately designed to make you want to see the next episode (if you like that kind of thing).
So, once again, it's easier to paint a single, easy target than to face the problem in general, which is boredom. People get bored, they want something to do, be it TV, Films, Internet, Games, Alcohol, Drugs etc, they are all an attempt to divert themselves from how shit real-life is.
But, of course, it's easier for people to blame the escape route than the problem.
As for her comparison between substance abuse and video game addiction. I call bullshit, I work with kids with substance abuse problems and I can tell you she is talking out of her arse.
I think many games are being designed to be addictive the way slot machines have been gradually refined to be more addictive, and the way religions are shaped over time to be extremely addictive. They exploit little quirks in our brains that create a disproportionate and irrational sense of reward.
I am mostly thinking of "casual" games.
I suppose the thing is though, even about Slot Machines is that they add bells and whistles to a gambling addiction. Not neccesarily 'right' or 'ethical', but the addiction to gambling was already present.
I do agree that, particuarly in the case of casual games, it uses the human brain's ability to enjoy simple challenges (shoot the ducks, line up the colours etc) and rewards with 'cute' sounds and visual effects, that kind of 'addiction to having fun' has been preyed upon since people invented board games (ironically enough, most early board games were also gambling games).
I think what Dr Phil is targetting here, however, is the 'big' games like MMO's, RPG's etc. Personally, I think they don't so much appeal to a need for risk, but the exact opposite, people feel 'safe' in games like that, if things get hairy, they can just log-off and not get involved, unlike real life.
However, if that is the case, It cannot be defined as an addiction, since someone who is addicted to drugs, for example, doesn't stop doing drugs just because it might be a bit risky, that is addiction, when someone doesn't care about the effects either on themselves or other people, whilst there are people out there who behave like that, the same can be said for other forms of entertainment, and the problem quite definitely lay with the person, not the media itself.
No. It's not chemical addiction. It is actual, factual mind control. Arcane sigils that, when beheld by the human mind, give rise to an engineered response in that human. It's not just "addictive personalities" that are affected. We all have the qualities that advertizers, casinos, and certain games and movies exploit. It isn't a single factor, it is literally thousands, which are present to greater and lesser degrees in all of us.
I said quite clearly that slot machines were the refinement of an idea. Yes, gambling IS one of those irrational triggers that we can be controlled with! Some people are more vulnerable to it than others. You rarely find a person who is attracted to all forms of gambling, but they are out there. Slot machines, video poker terminals, plinko machines, etc etc use many other tools besides simply the irrational reward of gambling. It is an addiction arms race.
I think these dirty tricks are fascinating, but my interest is in discovering what they are so that with the conscious knowledge, we can make ourselves more immune. I also try to design games that do not exploit these tricks. It is very hard. I try to create a feeling of accomplishment. But, it has to rise from an ACTUAL, meaningful accomplishment, not just a pile of virtual gold finally reaching 1m tall or whatever. Typically I do this by having the player produce a electronic artifact of intrinsic usefulness, or by helping them reach a useful understanding of systems they encounter in real life.
'Arcane sigils that, when beheld by the human mind, give rise to an engineered response in that human'
Is that response engineered genetically or socially then? Like the 'addiction' to having the latest, and best, sportwear for your child, is that powered by an actual 'need' or something that the advertisments tell you they 'need'.
As for writing a computer game without those 'addictive' elements, good luck with that, though I doubt you will get very far, the moment you write a game which you yourself enjoy playing, you want to play it more than once, there will always be those that get carried away and become addicted.
As for 'virtual gold', I remember many years ago there was a problem with people getting addicted to PacMan points. You build something where you can accumulate anything, and there will be hoarders, be it points, gold etc, even opening up new levels by completing the last one can be said to be an addiction-causing feature, just like 'tune in next week' is in TV shows.
It is psychological engineering.
Games don't feel good. *Play* feels good. It feels good, because it is good for us. It is good for us because it stimulates us in was our non-play life might be failing to provide, and if parts of our brain are never stimulated, they stop working well. It is good for us because it is an effective way to learn about almost anything, real or imaginary.
Some games are genuine play. We all know that many games are GOOD for us, even video games! Some games trick us into thinking we are playing and learning and doing something good, but really, we are not. Under comercial pressure, game designers will use every trick, both the ones that are good for us and the ones that are not, to create the most compelling product they can. In other words, junk food. Potentially toxic junk food. We have no idea!
I try to create toys that enable real play. I try to know where the fun is coming from, and whether it is driving any sort of improvement in the player. I am especially interested in games that produce useful work.
The problem is, being involved in creating games that are designed not to be like what you percieve as deliberately addictive ones, I cannot consider your opinion unbiased. You believe that companies invest millions into finding ways to create addicts, I wont argue with you in context, I just don't think it's nearly as wide-spread or deliberate as you imply, play is fun, and addictive, regardless of what the rewards are etc, it's an escape from chores, and chores are, through their compulsion, work.
I don't think anyone plays a game thinking 'This is good for me!', they do it because it's fun to do, and humans have been addicted to fun since before we were humans, and the more fun something is, the more people will do it.
My brother was addicted to fruit machines for years, he ended up going to Gamblers Anonymous, but it wasn't just fruit machines he was addicted to, it was risk, anything where he could gamble for the possibility of winning, I see the same thing with computer games, that is why there are a great many addictive freeware games out there, they weren't created to be addictive and make the author money, they were created to be fun, and fun is addictive, there's a lot less deliberate intent involved than is implied, purely the fact that what makes games fun is ALSO what makes them addictive.
What a childish perception on addiction. And I seriously doubt if she has actually delt with someone that had a substance abuse problem if she's trying to make a comparison with video games.
Addiction is a dependency, where the person feels an absolute need to indulge in the substance in order to feel "normal". It is more telling of the individual person's mental state than anything else as, as others have pointed out, anything a person finds pleasurable can become an addiction.
With substance abuse the issue becomes even deeper. By their very design most drugs are created to get the person physically addicted. Shooting up heroin or snorting coke alters the chemistry in your brain, making the impulse to indulge in it much stronger than any common activity. Also breaking an addiction to a substance is much, much harder because your body physically reacts to the sudden withdrawl. Heroin has probably the most infamous withdrawl symptoms as they include violent shaking, delusions, vomiting, pain, etc. etc. I've never once known someone having to deal with such effects from not playing Halo 3 for a couple of days.
This idiot should take a trip to the local drug rehabilitation clinic and see what the effects of real substance abuse is. She is demeaning the work and effort of drug counsolers everywhere with her lack of brain function.
I was just about to say the exact same thing but since you did I'd just like to say I fully agree. My problem is what constitutes an addiction to video games? Is it that you get headaches when you haven't played in a while? Do you get the DT's? I mean the closest thing I can think of to a video game addiction is those horror stories you always hear come out of places like China where people neglect themselves and families to play MMO's.
Amazon raid in 3... 2... 1... Not this again. We don´t need another Cooper Lawrence talking biased BS about games. The worst part is I think the woman already knows she is a total media whore and she likes it.
The cynical side of videogames (spanish only): http://thelostlevel.blogspot.com/ My DeviantArt Page (aka DeviantCensorship): http://www.darkknightstrikes.deviantart.com/
Waiting on Mr Eisen to chime in with "they can't be addictive."
They can be. However, as everyone else points out, so can anything else. It's personality type, influence and upbringing that contributes to that. There are differences between psychological and physical addiction however it's the second word, "addiction." That is the point. Not how one gets there.
Everyone should read her blog before posting because what is here is only a small part of it. You will better understand her points, if not necessarily agree with them.
That's true !
Here is a sample of what she has to say. At least read it before overreacting :
"I believe in the social ten percent rule. It goes like this: In any given organization, ten percent of the members wear, say and do things that make the other ninety percent look really bad. They’ll attract media attention, speak for the group when they have no authority to do so, and thoroughly ruin the group’s public reputation. Any normal ninety-percenter will feel shame in openly admitting their membership, thanks to the bottom ten percent. Think about it. There’s an actively destructive bottom ten percent in every group you can think of. It doesn’t matter if you’re thinking of religion, of politics, of the neighborhood, or a profession. Someone, or a minority group of some ones, is currently working very hard to make sure you look like an idiot.
This is ten percent rule is absolutely true of people who play video games. The irony is that the very extreme, but very vocal, minority abusing video games are actually considered cool. Their bad behavior is ignored, excused, and even reverenced. Unless challenged, in which case, the apologetic excuses come out. I play for the educational value, to improve my reflexes, etc.
(...)
It’s time to stop making excuses. We play because video games are fun. When they stop being fun, for the gamer OR their friends and family, it’s time to take a step back and get serious. Video games should be fun - for everyone. At the very least, they shouldn’t be coming between people who care about each other. We live in a fast-paced, demanding world. Very few gamers can actually control their game time, balance other responsibilities, and treat those who surround them with respect when they’re squeezing out more than fifteen hours a week to play. We hurt more people than ourselves when we do. Our families suffer, the game industry suffers, and in the long run, we all suffer."
More here : http://gamewidoworg.blogspot.com/2008/05/its-problem-but-not-for-me.html
Oh, and here is another sample :
"I spent years digging around behind the smoke and light show that game designers hide behind. I saw them on camera and off. I saw miles of dirty laundry…memos that shouldn’t have left the company, stories that shouldn’t have left the Human Resources office, attitudes that shouldn’t have been shared in the hallways with just anyone listening. It’s clear to me the game addiction phenomenon wrecking lives, finances, relationships and careers was not foreseen and planned by these game designers. They wanted the loyalty of their consumer fans, but they had no idea how far it could go. They’re actually, secretly, very frightened by the emergence of addictive game player behavior, and the anger of the general public over it."
I read the whole blog post and thought it was pretty good.
My only problem is that she like everyone else is comparing the video game industry to the likes of the tobacco industry. She expects the video game industry to front the cash to research this so called "game addiction"
Why should they? Do the creators of television and internet content have to front the cash to study their addictions?
Where will the blame stop? When does it become the responsibility of the addictee to find what is driving them to their addiction? If they have a problem with playing a game too much, it is their responsibility to seek help, not the creator of the game.
Here we are back to that little thing called personal responsibility.
E. Zachary Knight
http://www.editorialgames.com
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
MySpace Page: http://www.myspace.com/okceca
Facebook Page: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1325674091
Come on.
Games are made to be FUN! It turns out that fun stuff is addicting. I'M SHOCKED.
I think addiction can occur whenever our pleasure centre starts making irrational decisions. Things generally feel good and make us happy because they are good for us. The good feeling reinforces the memory of the action and makes us more likely to do it again. When we start getting good feelings from things that do not really help or are harmful, and especially when they come from actions that are easy to reproduce, it encourages and reinforces harmful or superstitious habbits. Chemical addictions typically trigger a pleasure response directly. or desensitize us to negative stimulus. But imagine you felt happy every time you saw a stop sign, and how that could warp your behaviour. Human minds have lots of such irrational happiness triggers. Advertizing is just applied psychology, attempting to exploit those triggers to make us do things that aren't really in our best interest -- and make feel us happy about doing it. Games can apply exactly those sort of dirty tricks to make people play them more.
the video game industry makes games addictive on purpose. - - Duhhhh, you think....
Do people acutally watch Dr. Phil???
Stay at home moms, for the most part.
Video Game Addiction is as real as Internet Addiction Disorder..
That is, completely not!
The criterias for "videogame addiction" can also be, AND ALREADY ARE, used to define any other activity a human being could possibly enjoy.
And I quote : "An overbroad description of addiction leaves open the possibility of every compensatory behavior being declared an addiction. For example, a person who has lengthy telephone conversations with a friend to avoid an unpleasant situation could be declared "addicted to the telephone" with equal validity as a person who chats on the Internet with the same basic goal at bottom.
Many others, including Carol Potera, agree that Internet Addiction is inappropriately named. To the extent that the Internet is a social medium instead of an object, people cannot be addicted to it. The analogy is made to an environment: a person can not be truly addicted to living in a favorite town (no matter how distressing a change of home might be), and a goldfish can not be addicted to living in a pond.
Secondly, it is widely recognized, even by its supporters, that most if not all "Internet addicts" already fall under existing, legitimate diagnostic labels. For many patients, overuse or inappropriate use of the Internet is merely a manifestation of their depression, anxiety, impulse control disorders, or pathological gambling. In this criticism, IAD is compared to food addiction, in which patients overeat as a form of self-medication for depression, anxiety, etc., without actually being truly addicted to eating."
So yeah, videogame abuse identical to that of substance abuse? I think not!
I think the final analogy makes it clear that we're not talking about normal enjoyment. Everyone eats food. "Everyone" plays video games. Everyone enjoys food. "Everyone" enjoys video games. But not everyone who eats and enjoys food is a "food addict", nor is everyone who enjoys playing video games a "video game addict".
If MacDonalds held a contest for children to see who could eat the most McNuggets, I think they would be rightfully condemned for encouraging "food abuse". I think a case could be made that some video game vendors are actively encouraging "game abuse".
Does this mean we will be seeing "infect Truth" commercials 10-20 years from now about how the evil game industry sells addictive & deadly products? Should game players be treated as poorly as smokers are?
This is hardly suprising. Anti-game folk have failed playing the violence angle, so addiction will be the next approach.
Those truth commercials make no sense and only prove that talking to kids about how smoking, drinking, and doing drugs dosen't make you cool is now a moot point because only abstract commercials of stupidity will get kids to stop doing drugs.....which is won't.
Punctuation please?
The Truth ads are targeted as an increasingly difficult to reash group of the nation: Over stimulated teens and pre teens (I won't use the word tweens). This same method sells them their clothes, movies and IPods: Get their attention, leave them with a lasting memory of the product; in this case the dangers of smoking. Raising awareness at that age is the single best way to help kids avoid drug and alcohol abuse in the future. Its a good program and it is working. More and more states are going smoke free.
The best way to stop is to never start in the first place.
Does this mean we're going to get a "Non-Video Gaming" section in resteraunts?
The question at hand at the Dr. Phil Show taping was whether the video game industry makes games addictive on purpose.
Gee, that's a somewhat negative way to say "the game industry tries to make games that will last". Let's just stop playing addictive games and pay for a $60 coaster that will only be in our game consoles for 5 hours before we put it away forever.
Pot, Video Games, Booze, Cigarettes....
As long as my list of addictions NEVER includes the 'Dr. Phil' show, I suspect I'll be just fine :)
Anything not taken in moderation can be addicted.
But personally I'd rather have someone I care about addicted to video games rather than drugs and other things like that as trying to fix the addiction might be just a hard but atleast you don't have to worry about the addiction ending up killing someone due to them being under the influence while behind a car wheel.
I think that video game addiction is a real problem for some people, and the knee jerk reactions of some of the people on this forum are part of the reason people see gamers as immature.
Instead of stopping to think about what this woman is saying, many of the posts on this site ridicule her.
Who on this forum doesn't know at least one person who has completely lost themselves in an MMORPG to the detriment of their social life, their lives, their jobs, and their families?
Gamers go to the same ridiculous extremes to defend their hobby as people like Jack Thompson go to in order to malign it. Except instead of saying "games are bad", they say "there is no possible way games could ever be bad".
Unless we are able to take a thorough examination of both the good AND the bad qualities of gaming, then we will forever find things like this popping up in the mainstream media, b\c we just keep putting our heads in the sand, and pretending everything is great.
Oh snap!
I haven't played a video game in 3 hours!
(runs into bathroom with PSP)
What a RUSH!
Loaded question. Video games are not made to be addictive, at least in the sense that video games are not designed for players to form a dependency on them.
Video games are designed to be fun. That's it. If you spend hours and hours having a great time with your video game of choice then the designers have succeeded in making a fun game. If you decide to forgo hygiene and your personal life in order to play a game, that's your problem and certainly not what the designers intended.
Andrew Eisen
Come to think of it, does anyone really care about Dr. Phail anymore?
That implies that anyone cared about him in the first place.
I'm kinda torn on this. I have known people who have basically forgone their real life in order to play video games. It ends up destroying their social life, their body gets incredibly out of shape, and it causes a ton of problems if they have a job (and manage to keep it). On the other hand, comparing it to substance abuse is somewhat ridiculous, saying it's exactly the same doesn't sit well with me. I don't know if she's ever met someone who was addicted to meth or crack, but it's not even possible for someone to destroy their bodies and mind so much with video games. The problem I have with her comparison is that substance abuse is obviously a physical addiction, while gaming can form a psychological addiction. Basically with substance abuse the substance itself causes the addiction, meaning that when you drop it you not only have extreme psychological withdrawals but physical ones as well. With video games you may have the urge to play them if you "give them up" but you're not oging to come down with the shakes or have siezures or anything. As some other people said, its easy to paint her as an enemy of gaming when she directly compares being addicted to gaming as being exactly the same as say heroin or crystal meth. I've had members of my family go to jail for substance abuse, obviously it can turn out far worse than being "addicted" to games.
yes video games can be a addiction but is way differnt addiction then subestence abuse. I do amdit i play to much video games but you know what if i quite playing for a few weeks i dont have any thing but my mind saying i want to play again. subestence make it where your body needs that item, you body not getting the shakes or trembles becuse you are not playing video games. Plus everthing can be a addiction from skateboarding to watching movies and drinking to much soda.
Thanks
Zaruka
This all begs the question, if gaming is as destructive as she claims then why is she married to a "drug" dealer?
Pure and utter nonsense. All of it. Not even worth debating. "Game Addiction" is better translated as "Morons Disease" or "Insecure Wife Syndrome". My husband is having too much fun. Oh no!
While I do think that some people can become "addicted" to video games, I also A) believe that it is a very few people who have psychological problems... and B) nobody should care or have any sympathy or consideration for them.
Addiction to anything, be it video games, smoking, alcohol or drugs is something people go into willingly... they conciously make a decision to go into this thing they know can cause them problems.... of course, chemical addictions make even less sense, since everyone knows that they are physically bad for you.
Addictions in general are entirely the fault of the person who suffers from them, and they should be blamed, nobody else.
The video game industry designs its games to be physiologically addictive. We have the proof. By the way, many of you, as indicated by your many posts at any story having to do with me, apparently have a Jack Thompson Addiction, so in order to feed that wonderful beast, here's your latest fix. Have a great weekend. Jack Thompson
Heh, and yo uaccuse the rest of us of violationg the posting rules.
damn that's what you do now you have more free time. I wonder how many hours that took. Looks like somebody is addicted to creating this sort of stuff!
COPYPASTA: Do you speak it?
And still nobody cares about you, Jack Dorkshomp.
The cynical side of videogames (spanish only): http://thelostlevel.blogspot.com/ My DeviantArt Page (aka DeviantCensorship): http://www.darkknightstrikes.deviantart.com/
"Physiological"? Are you sure you're using the right word there? Might want to consult a dictionary and make sure because as video games exist today, it's impossible to develop a physiological addiction to them.
Furthermore, do you have any credible sources to back up that claim with?
Andrew Eisen
"Pysiologically?" No. Just no. You don't know how they work. The developers and the gamers DO.
And "we?" Who's "we?" This is just you. You're not working with anyone.
Any pleasurable activity can become addictive. THIS is fact. In your case, too much immaturity = losing your job.
Have a nice weekend, and "life."
Posting that bar register number while you still have it, eh?
Jack.. Jack.. you know you said youve never broken posting rules?
youve just done it.. AGAIN.
Wooohooo next post after thompson *bumps some hilary duff music* seriously Jack dude go get a life man...i mean come on after how many Years now you still wont leave us alone at Gp??? Wow someone wants to have Friends!!!!
awwww how cute...The little lawyer is scared he will lose his license....who's a good thompson?? who's a good thompson????
sorry dennis couldnt help it
Ok now on another note...i personally think this person is a moron but hey i can understand her point to a certain degree...but with what she said about gaming being the same as drug addiction in a sense is bulls*** and it shows how ignorant she really is...
Why are people so stupid
I think i've seen that weird long-ass post before,And i recall a Fail troll doing it,And yes I think a "Game addiction" is cow shit compared to Real People Who die of addictions and problems such as Alcohol,Drugs and firearms,I bet someday this stupid lady is going to try to get the us goverment to make an ATFVG, Meaning Acohol,Tobacco,Firearms and Video games.
Im thinking her husband had a good reseason to have a game addiction or something like that.
Before this goes much further, I'd like to stick two cents in here...as the origin of the debate. First, if you read Game Widow, or more of my blogging, you'll know I cover all the points mentioned here. I also take the stance that "game addiction" is a slang term, not an officially recognized diagnosis. I hate the term, too, but the only way to speak about game abuse, and actually have people understand what issue you're referring to, is to use this less-than-accurate term. To the point, there hasn't been enough scientific research by unbiased, qualified people to determine if there is a chemical abuse situation going on with the pre-existing horomones etc in the human body when gamers play, or if the "addiction" phenomenon is all behavioral. But the chemical/behavioral debate over the nature of addiction has been going on even among scientists for years. The debate is messy, because at the core of it, there really are very few solid facts - it's hard to draw parallels between dependencies we think we understand and those we don't really, because as mentioned above, some dependencies seem to be weak, and others incredibly powerful. What I do know for sure is that playing an MMO for long hours changed my husband's personality in the same way that abusing substances changed the personality of another family member of mine. I don't care about the eventual determination of the science, I just point out where it now stands. I care about men, women and children experiencing real physical and emotional harm resulting from game abuse. We need a solution, not an argument about terminology. You don't have to see a family member die to respect the horror of addictive behavior - chemical or behavioral. You just have to feel the fear, the gut terror, of seeing it happen to someone you love, and having it tear down everyone around them. I feel incredibly lucky that addiction hasn't claimed the life of anyone I know, and hope it never does anyone you know, either.
I don't expect you to read Game Widow. That's too much to ask. But give me the benefit of the doubt. I know some of the posters here are having a knee-jerk, self-protective reaction to being attacked many times before, but this isn't like that, despite your opinion of Dr. Phil. Being interviewed by the media and taking your lumps is part of the obligation of publishing a book. Jason Della Rocca, Nick Yee, and Erin Hoffman have all read Game Widow, and endorsed it as fair and well-researched. The Dr. Phil contracts I signed to be on the show clearly stated that Dr. Phil was not an accredited counselor, and I researched the show before going on. I expected short shrift. You should also be media savvy, and be able to separate out showmanship from substance.
Yes, I think the game industry needs to take a stand on this issue as self-preservation, but that doesn't mean paying for research. After all, if the industry sponsors research, the results are then suspected of bias, and useless. Encouraging research is not the same as funding it. The poster who mentioned gamer responsiblity was right on...gamers are the primary decision makers on whether or not to abuse. Game makers can put in all the save points and safety features they want, and gamers can blow past them or disable play monitors. But it doesn't end there. Game widows (and widowers) also need to take some responsibility and quit enabling bad behavior when it crops up. Quit making excuses, taking dinner to the computer, and saving the gamer from the consequences of their choice to play instead of (fill in the blank). Not everyone abuses games. But until we, as a culture, deal with the issue of those who do, those of us who don't will never be able to play in peace.
As for the publishing just to get attention...dude, if you think the attention here is something you'd want, you're welcome to it. The public is cruel, and gamers are worse. I have no illusions about the unpleasantness of publicity, and heartily wished someone else had written this book...before it was even published. I thought about writing under a pseudonym, but in a debate as important as this one, it's only fair to let readers know exactly who is talking so they can accept or reject the information offered by considering its source.
Hey Wendy. Thanks for dropping by and posting. It's always cool to have the subjects of our discussions pop in now and then.
I admit, I haven't had a chance to check out your blog yet but I look forward to doing so over the weekend. I agree and have always found it interesting that the debate over game addiction, heated as it can get, always seems to come down to semantics - what is actually meant by "addiction."
Hopefully, your segment on Dr. Phil goes well and brings to light the points actually worth discussing.
Best,
Andrew Eisen
The problem with the term "game addiction" is normal people (without basic notions of psycology) will take it like "droug addiction" and as a real medical term and not as a slang like you suggest, not matter how hard you try to cover it. And you don´t hate that term. You still using it as a valid term to describe an adicttion, as "game widows" to sell your ideas.
You use them because they are "hot" words, and they sell.
The people is looking all videogames as a disease and they are learning to be afraid of their own children. I accept there is many people with problems with the videogames, but is not the majority of all gamers. We are really tired of people looking us as criminals or walking time-bombs looking for explode.
We are tired of the Jack Thompsons or Cooper Lawrences taking advantage from real problems and making it bigger and affecting many more people in a negative way, just for get fame, attention and money.
It´s true that videogames are not something for die for (not even defending them), but I think the feedback is fair, even if is cruel, like you said. Because you have the massive media to express yourself, and we don´t.
I think the cruelty comes from other way.
The cynical side of videogames (spanish only): http://thelostlevel.blogspot.com/ My DeviantArt Page (aka DeviantCensorship): http://www.darkknightstrikes.deviantart.com/
This is the most dumbest shit i ever read in my life that bitch wants to make money!
...you see the irony in that statement, right?
-Remember kids, personal responsibility is for losers! For information on games and psychology, look up: Jonathan Freedman(2002)Block & Crain(2007) Just to name a few...
DR phill is stil on TV?
I is fuzzy brained mew =^^=
http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/
(in need of a bad overhaul)
While I wasn't addicted to SOCOM, I played it a whole lot. Somewhere between competitive and just plain fun (I usually mixed the 2 in wars since I wasn't good). I know the topic isn't focused on that game itself, but its coincidence that the game I played for a few years is involved.
I played SOCOM a lot because, at the time, I was going through a bumpy road and wanted to get my fun on in some way...and I met some of the most awesome friends on there (some of which I still talk to, started like 4 or 5 years ago). I didn't play for the actual game itself, but for the people I played with. All coming together and just screwing and joking around (team killing by using the back of an AT4 for instance), having some good, bad, and bizzare conversations...just having a blast. That's what I played for. It wasn't to be number 1 or anything...just having fun.
It's a real debate to consider gaming an addiction. Some points were made that if you don't like a game you won't play it...can also be said about smoking (if you don't like the taste you don't smoke it).
Gaming addiction is more of a mental thing. It's focusing on the need of a person, as in a friend. Online gamers have a safer route since most involve actual interaction with other people, but then there are health hazzards to be considered.
Everyone can pick up the controller, but people need to learn to put it down. Just like artists can pick up a pencil or a musician can pick up the guitar...there a many ways to be addicted to something, its the will to put those things down makes the difference in considering it an addiction.
rep +1
MMO is a serious addiction that needs to be looked at now.
I mean, seriously.. how can people play such utter filth for so long and *enjoy* it?
"I’ve personally lived through both the addiction of a family member to substance abuse, and video game abuse. There are no differences in the experience..."
You know, I think there are a hell of a lot of people with alcoholism and drug abuse in their families who would be fully justified in responding to that statement with "Go to hell."
GP: another JT court document snipped...
I'm not deleting the comment entirely, otherwise the replies will disappear as well.
Mr. Thompson, you already had your disciplinary trial that dealt with your conduct. That's what disciplinary hearings are for: the conduct of the defending attorney. From the transcript, you didn't seem to know that. (Read Tunis' report if you don't believe me. When a witness was asked how your conduct offended them, you claimed it was irrelevant when your conduct was the basis of the hearing.) You thought instead that you were prosecuting Blank Rome and other people who you DON'T just send motions to.
They don't think of you as a raging lunatic, homophobe, and fascist because you file the motions at all. It's because of the infantile way you do so, with insults egregiously unbecoming of a 50-something year old man, and not only just once, but numerous times, as if they have some sort of obligation to respond to you IMMEDIATELY and put everything else in their jobs and otherwise on hold. Sorry, Mr. Thompson, but the world doesn't revolve around you. That's not how the world of law, and the world in general, works. You're not a police officer. You can't MAKE your own deadlines. You're a lawyer. (and i'm not, yet i still know this.)
I shouldn't have to list the reasons why you're a disgusting excuse of a human being, from stepping on the graves of the VT victims before the dirt was even dry to wading through the blood-tinted flood waters of Hurricane Katrina to your disrespect of your own wife and son just to further yourself.
You're done, Mr. Thompson. Not because of your christianity or cause, but your blatent disregard for human compassion.
David "DavCube" Gagnon.
PS: Posting these filings of yours in the comment section is the violation that Dennis continually mentions. Just e-mail them to him. Since you're so convinced that he's 'obsessed' with you, (He didn't call you six times a day sounding like a forlorn lover, or so it sounds like in that 2007 article series about your attack on this site) he just might make an update on it.
Oh, forgot something, Mr. Thompson. They're not persecuting you for being on 60 minutes. They're persecuting you for bringing it up as though it actually matters for.... anything. Because it doesn't. You talking on a program is absolutely, positively unrelated to any case that you have ever taken place in.
In short: the only thing it achieves is you bragging that you were on TV. Bragging is something that's kind of frowned upon in the field of law. Sure, Boston Legal may tell you otherwise, but that's fiction. Sir, you're no Denny Crane.
What's the tastiest mint in the world? DIS BAR MINT
The only mint that it's more fun to watch someone else eat, you mean.
I had a chance to read it, and to be honest it does seem like there are certain legitimate issues mentioned. It's unfortunate that legitimate issues are tackled by someone who has offered up a lot of libel, paranoia and outright lies. In the end it appears that both parties have done wrong, and two wrongs don't make a right.
And after all this time, Jack, you clearly still don't get it.
What are you going to do when you're disbarred? Wait, I know the answer to that one - you'll appeal it. And when the Appeals Board refuses to consider reopening the case, you'll appeal to the Supremes. When they refuse to consider it, you'll start crying about how it's a vast conspiracy against you.
Here's a clue, Jack - you're not that important, and you're surely not relevant.
You already had a trial Jack. But instead of defending yourself, you decided to harrass the lawyers of Blank Rome and complain about videogames. There's no second chances.
Yeah jacky, You make friendly morons with brief moments of intellect look (like me) bad, Your disbbarrment and all we need is now your suicide.
MAGIC TACO HAS SPOKEN
This kind of comment is unneccesary. Hate him all you like, but talking about suicide is crossing the line.
Give it a few years after he loses everything.
When Life gives you lemons, you find a new god.
Agreed. Let's keep the level of conversation here at a respectable tone and not, I repeat, not taunt the dynomite monkey.
I've been channeling J.J Walker again.
Dynamite. :)
<i>The video game industry designs its games to be physiologically addictive.</i>
They would need some kind of chemical in order to accomplish that.
<i>We have the proof.</i>
Well, I'd love to see it. Seriously, it would be nice for you to actually prove something for once. And who is "we", exactly? You and the voices in your head, perhaps?
<i>By the way, many of you, as indicated by your many posts at any story having to do with me, apparently have a Jack Thompson Addiction, so in order to feed that wonderful beast, here's your latest fix.<i>
Addiction? Nah. You are amusing though. Like a monkey playing the bagpipes or something.
<i>Have a great weekend. Jack Thompson</i>
Why thank you Jack. Always good to see you drop by. Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.
Jack, I'd like to explain the people here's "Jack Thompson Addiction".
You see there were/are many people who are addicted to The Three Stooges. And I don't know if you watched much Three Stooges but in the episodes they took on many odd jobs like chefs, plumbers, carpenters, etc. Now did people watch the Stoogest intently because they were masters at their trades? No, they failed and failed hard! Hence the allure of the show.
We want to see as much about you as we can. You are a failure at life and you provide us with a nonstop amounts of amusement as your career goes down in flames and your sanity is in a freefall.
Dance you pathetic little stooge. We need amusement.
i really couldnt have put it better myself
Agreed
When Life gives you lemons, you find a new god.
Oh great ol Phill is going to be talking out of his arse and trashing games again.
Penn and Teller Bullshit can't get here quick enough.
Hey wait a minute, Dr. Phill's show comes out in October bullshit doesn't start season 7 till ... spring? There's nothing that says they won't touch game addiction on that episode. Also Penn has said that he hates Dr. Phil more than once on bullshit.
I wonder ...
Wow, amazing.
The show taped on September 16 in Los Angeles. I'm recovering from a very destructive gaming addiction and was a guest on this episode with Wendy Kays, so I met her and heard everything she had to say about the gaming industry. Her perspective is remarkably sane and balanced. You've nothing to fear.
Please do a couple of things before commenting further:
1. Wait until the episode airs, last week of September or first week of October is most likely based on what the production team have told us.
2. Read Wendy's book. You can buy it direct from GameWidow.org or Amazon.com
Thanks,
Brad
http://www.exgamer.net
Well I'd suggest finding the book at the library, or reading it within Barnes and Nobel. No reason to be giving money to someone one might end up not agreeing with now is there?
I'm sure no one reads this far down but I used to be horribly addicted to opiates, we are talking I literally injected myself every 4-6 hours, only slept 5 and half hours a night, drank, took uppers, etc. the whole nine yards and I've also played a lot of video games. While I've spent the odd weekend playing ALL day, the two things are really NOT similar. I'm totally functional when I play computer games. I might play an hour one night or 8 hours on a day off but really if I have work I don't miss work and if I have other stuff to do I do other stuff. I go out with friends, have a social life, have had girlfriends (addiction is not conducive to successful long term relationships) and can still play games. I can see how people can get alittle too carried away with games but it is NOT THE SAME as chemical addiction. You might as well say that kids who spend all their time reading fiction are addicted to the fantasy of it. Yet no one is sitting there saying we need to stop kids from reading books.
You already had a trial Jack. But instead of defending yourself, you decided to harrass the lawyers of Blank Rome and complain about videogames. There's no second chances.The show taped on September 16 in Los Angeles. I'm recovering from a very destructive gaming addiction and was a guest on this episode with Wendy Kays, so I met her and heard everythingTiffany Ring she had to say about the gaming industry. Tiffany JewelleryHer perspective is remarkably sane and balanced. You've nothing to fear.Tiffany JewellerySo if we just don't pay any attention to their comments no matter how rediculas they are, then they won't win. I feel that over the years, the more and more attention these people get over their bashing of Videogames, the more they do it. It is kinda like what happened when I was being teased at school. the kids used to tease me allot about the Cats loosing Grand Finals during the 90's and I would cry or try to hit them and yell trying to make them stop saying things like that. but at the end of the day, no matter if I tried to hit them, I would be in trouble because I was behaving violent.
I worry about claims of video game addiction. Wile I'm sure it does happen, I don't think it occurs as often as sensationalism might have you believe.
Games are probably better compared to gambling and gambling addiction than drug addiction.
Games are designed to provide a similar action/reward/feeback system that gambling provides.
If Dr.Phil doesn't liken the concepts behind game design to rats pushing buttons, I think we should all start to questino him as a mental health professional, or at the very least, question the research that goes into the topic.
Together with Wendy, I'm a guest on this episode of Dr. Phil, and if it starts an intelligent dialogue on excessive gaming, then I've done my job.
Brad
http://www.exgamer.net