Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

November 22, 2008 -

Over at kombo, Nick Michetti has penned a thoughtful article titled How Barack Obama Can Bring the Change the Video Game Industry Needs.

While some of his ideas have merit, a suggestion that Obama regulate the used game market marred the piece for me. Michetti writes:

We also need to rein in the used games market and not with DRM. It is fundamentally unfair that developers are being robbed of profits for work that they've done. If the ESA will not offer a mandate, then we'll need the government to do so. Publishers and developers should be entitled to at least half of the price from the sale of every used game.

 

However, we need for there to be caps on used game prices and a Blue Book system for video games to prevent price gouging. We also need for developers to respect our tradition of the second hand market and have part of the mandate state that developers cannot use DRM to inhibit used sales.

Ignoring the fact that the ESA, which represents game publishers, has no wherewithal to issue any type of mandate to game retailers, I just don't get Michetti's point. Actually, I don't get the point of anyone who is whining about used game sales (like Epic's Michael Capps).

The reason is simple. Industry types - capitalists, all - who seek to restrict used game sales would interfere with the way markets work. And they want to interfere in a way that is purely for their own benefit and decidely anti-consumer. In this case, anti-gamer.

By way of example, let's say that a carpenter builds a table under contract from a furniture manufacturer. The carpenter gets paid and the manufacturer in turn wholesales the table to a furniture store. The furniture store adds their markup and sells the table to a homeowner. Later, the homeowner remodels and picks up a few bucks by peddling the table through an ad on Craigslist.

Now, replace "table" with "video game." The game developer is the carpenter. The game publisher is the furniture manufacturer. The game retailer is the furniture store. The gamer is the homeowner.

In both cases, there was an economic chain. Everyone got paid for the services. Are we now going to allow the carpenter and the furniture manufacturer to say to the homeowner, "Hey, you can't sell that table. We want everyone to be forced to buy a new table."

Of course not.

Along this line, I was impressed with a recent blog post by veteran game developer Soren Johnson (Spore, Civ series), who writes:

Many factors come into play when a consumer decides if a specific game purchase is worth the money, and one of those factors is the perceived value from selling it back as a used game. In other words, people will pay more for a new game because they know they can get some of that money back when they trade it in at the local Gamestop.

 

Importantly, this perceived value exists whether the consumer actually sells the game or keeps it. Wizards of the Coast has long admitted that the existence of the secondary market for Magic cards has long helped buoy the primary market because buyers perceive that the cards have monetary value.

UPDATE: Kudos to Nick Michetti, who dropped by to discuss his article in comments. I see that Kotaku also picked up the story.


Comments

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Why reign in an industry that is so wide spread and doing so well, the market has so much competition there is no need to control it. Sure if you only used the big box outlets you are going to be screwed but that’s only because you are paying for the overhead.

 

In fact we need regulation of returns and the wording for repacked or “refurbished” games we need to let retail sell a new return as new with a proper 30 “right of return” day warranty there is no reason to allow them some leeway in selling products as long as it wortks and the consumer is happy it dose not matter if its truly new or not..

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Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Is the guy serious?

On advertising in video games - This was probably an idea from a staffer because it's cheap and the campaign had lots of money, rather than a key part of the campaign.  At best it shows there's no absolute hatred of the games industry.

Second hand games - I agree with just about everyone else.  If the publishers don't like it, increase the retailer's markup or reduce prices.  The retailers need to used game sales because the markup on new games is too small for them to survive.

Tax deductions for devkits - They are already.  All business expenses are.

Tax cuts for middleware developers - Why?  they're doing pretty well.  They get gobbled up by the big players because they do so well.  (Also in a couple of cases, how?  One company is based in Dublin, and another in Oxford).  As for developing for new technology, they get a fair bit of help from Sony and Microsoft.  Also, this sector has fairly limited growth potential.  Demand is pretty much limited by the number of developers. 

Mandatory licencing fees to middleware developers whose software is included in SDKs - This already happens. 

Tax cuts for developing for new mediums - Fine but no need to make the games industry a special case.  Improvements in bottling technology or shrimp fishing are at least as important.

"affordable discs that all home console platforms should be forced to support" - I like this idea, apart from the "forced" aspect.  Should the government decide to approve an open standard, with industry backing then great.  Should console manufacturers choose to support it then also great.  I'm a little wary of the government micromanaging something that should be left to market forces. 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Well it was illeagal for Napster to be giving away their music, but the fact that Lars was complaining about it was rediculous, although that's another discussion.

 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Robbed of profits? Someone already bought the game, and probably for an unfairly high price. People need to learn that $60 video games are a big turn off for most consumers, even long-time gamers. If they'd simply sell it at a reasonable price people would have less of a reason to pirate it and to buy it used. But buying a game used it just part of the industry, it's not hurting anyone. It's a way to help retailers stay afloat, without whom the developers would have less places to sell their games the first time around.

I hate how publishers make up all this crap to make it look like they're going out of business because they're not stealing every cent from everyone every second of the day. It's like Lars Ulrich complaining about Napster. Once you've sold an 11X platinum album, you're not really in a position to complain about losing money over some stupid filesharing service.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

If anything, though, this is even worse than Lars Ulrich complaining about Napster. Metallica's copyrights really were being infringed by Napster, but what buyers and sellers of used games are doing is completely legal. I'd say this is more akin to unionized auto workers complaining about people buying imported cars because it lowers domestic car sales. Shameless, greedy behavior either way, though.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

@Jack:

This entire article has nothing to do with videogame violence. It's about used game sales, a completely different issue altogether. Stop trying to make everything about you in a misguided attempt at getting attention.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Pfft. Jack can't even spell "relevance" much less stop his attention whoring, if he tried. No more than the leopard can change its spots. 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

"First of all, Barack Obama is a big advocate of the First Amendment and First Amendment rights."

Source? To many pro fairness doctrine types around to sign off on this one.

"Publishers and developers who decide to develop for expensive and complex new mediums like Blu-ray should also get a tax cut or console manufacturers who use the new mediums should be forced to take smaller portions of their fees until the price of the medium comes down appropriately."

Tax cut is fine. Forced? Elaborate on this.

"Maybe Obama won't be receptive to our problems, maybe we won't want to reach out -- maybe this article is a plentitude of pipedreams doomed never to come to fruition."

This seems right.  Not exactly a great article and given Obama's desires to rais Capital Gains Taxes it seems unlikely that the gmaing industry stnads to really benefit from him in any direct sort of way.  Tax cuts for the industry would be great but there seems to be no inclination on Obama's part to make it happen.  The kind of cahnge Mr. Michetti desires seems more obtainable on the state level.  

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

I have warned for ten years that either the video game industry stop its sale of violence to kids, or the government would step in.  Barack Obama has made it clear, during the campaign, that he thinks he can fix everything, so get ready for the draconian governmental response to  the industry's recklessness.  I warned you.  You're welcome.  Jack Thompson 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Warned Us?

Don't make me laugh you fraud. Less than a month ago, you were claiming responsibilty for it, writing to Palin and trying to get that very kind of legislation put through.

Now, we all know you have more faces than the Alps, but your inconsistency is shining through like a beacon.

Just thought I'd let you know.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

"You're welcome."

Thanks, Jack.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For giving us 1u1z!   HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! PSYCHE!!!

 

 

 

 



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Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

The industry itself isn't responsible for sales, the retailers are as are the parents.

If a mother buys GTA for little Johnny it was her that did it, there was not soemoen from Take Two stickign copies of GTA 4 into people's carts, or do you believe they still use baskets.

As for the retailer, if they warn the parent and they purchase it anyway, they did all they can, if ythey make no effort on a warning, again, the industry had NOTHING to do with it, it was the sales clerk, and if there is no policy on it, the retailer's fault.

Oh, wait, forgot, personal responsibility is for terrorists, right?

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

For one, you should have listened to his statements about video games. He's asking parents to take a stand, not to regulate sales.

Secondly, go back to your own blog, GP-addict.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Obama doesn't really know about or care about the game industry.  Nice try though.

--- Official Protector of Videoland!

--- Official Protector of Videoland!

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

 I can see their point, except when I think about all of the old games I've bought used that weren't being produced.  I like to play 5+ years old games, and this would not allow me to.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

I don't think we should have laws that restrict used games from being sold.

Because used games are the first point where new gamers can try out games that don't cost as much.

Also I do feel that there are many parents who do feel that Videogames cost too much and the only way to counter that is when used games are being sold for half that price.

Like see a new Wii/XBox360/PS3 game in Australia costs $100 or $120 depending on the HD graphical power and already you can see the parents worry about their gamer kid wanting more and more games that cost allot of money.

The used game sales is what is going to be an easy way for new gamers and younger gamers who relly on their parents for the money to buy them are what are going to make a positive difference in the videogame community.

 

As for the possibility of Obama being talkative about other videogame issues like the First Amendment rights, it is a 50% possibility, all he needs is to let go of that old steriotype that Videogames are for kids and start thinking that Videogames are for adults too and also understand that the crime in america has dropped and that games like GTA and other Violent Videogames have had no real influence in crime to understand that there is no need to restrict Violent Videogames from adults who want to play them and instead focus on promoting the ESRB ratings system to parents so they can understand what it all means.

I feel that parents are able to listen better to a politician who is more high in public profile than to anyone within the industry who has not got any public profile but who is trying their best to help parents become aware of the ESRB.

 

TBoneTony

TBoneTony

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

For everyone talking about right of first sale, you may want to actually research the difference between how computer software and regular items are handled. You don't actually own any of the games you pay for, you just paid the company that made it to play. That's called a licensing agreement, and if the company put in a clause saying you can't resell it, they can take you to court for doing so.

 

The question becomes would this actually be practical or profitable, and the answer to that is probably no. But I think a lot of people on here are really uneducated about how purchasing a game actually works in the legal sense.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

You are right and licenses unless specified in the agreement are not transferable. But there have been at least one case where that was taken to court and First sale came through.

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080523-court-smacks-autodesk-affi...

AS for games, I think if it were taken to court, they would view games as more like other forms of entertainment and less like computer software such as Office or the Adobe Suite. Those software are used for commercial purposes and thus require licenses to limit their use and transfer of rights. But games are solely built to be entertainment.

The only way a game can bypass first sale is if the disk bought in the store did not contain everything needed to play. If that which is needed to play must be licensed from the publisher of the game. I am talking about private server type things. MMOs and such. Since you need to use the private servers of the MMO provider, they can get away with limiting the transfer of rights.

But games that contain everything needed to play the game, like all console games and the majority of PC games, they will be treated like DVDs, CDs, and books, as they are self contained entertainment works. There is nothing that needs to be licensed.

E. Zachary Knight
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
MySpace Page: http://www.myspace.com/okceca
Facebook Page: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1325674091

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Well DRM isn't really something new to those who legitimately have bought 3D software... or Windows for that matter. :) It can still be pirated, but I don't really begrude Autodesk for protecting their products and trying to make money. I sort of begrudge Microsoft, but that's because they are so damned evil. ;)

There's already a lot of discussion here and I was going to be this long post about different points, but I guess it comes to one for me:

What should the industry really do about second hand sales if it bothers them so much? I think they need to give consumers a reason to buy new instead of used. If you were given a choice between a used game at half price and a new game at full price, what would make you want to buy the new game instead of the used game?

For me, sometimes physical bonus items can sway me (figurines, art books, etc.). Maybe getting dibs on an item in-game. UO (yes I play that game) often prints one time use codes in their retail boxes for in-game items, but it's not the only game that does this. I remember a lot of games on the PS1 would have bonuses like analog covers and themed stickers for memory cards. If you bought used, usually these goodies have been looted by the original buyer, but if I wanted them enough, I would buy new instead.

 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

a) You do own the physical medium which carries the data. You also own (not rent) the license to install the game on a single computer. I'm not sure a license agreement that prohibited transfer of the license would be enforceable - I know software companies put all sorts of stuff in their EULAs that probably isn't, but no one knows for sure because it's never been tried judicially.

b) Console games are (until recently, at least) a separate case. Have you ever seen a EULA for a console game? I haven't, because I've never installed - that is, copied from one medium to another - one on a machine. License agreements exist because software companies let their customers install - again, that means copy - programs, which would technically be illegal if license were not explicitly granted. A console game, which (until recently) runs directly off the disc, is legally similar to a CD or DVD - you own the disc, and you can sell it or give it away to whomever you like.

(yes, I am aware that there are restrictions on how you can use a CD or DVD, but that's not the point at issue)

c) Even restricting ourselves to PC games, and even assuming that no-resale EULAs are enforceable: If a product can only ever be used (legally) by the owner, that's something I would think should factor into to price of purchase. Plainly speaking, a game that you can't resell should cost less than a game that you can resell, all else being equal.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

It's not necessarily unenforceable either, but like you and I both pointed out it's never been tested, mostly because I don't think any company has ever bothered to go after anyone.

Interestingly enough you don't actually have to physically copy anything. The copy going into RAM on the console is considered, by legalese, to eb a copy and it can be controlled. The agreement on your part comes in when you insert the disk or click accept on the little EULA button on your PC. It's called a click-wrap (after shrink wrap based from CDs, which is what comes into effect with console games) agreement and it's binding to the person who opened or installed the product the first time. These two actions are the same as signing an agreement with the publisher in the eyes of the law, that's what makes anything in a EULA enforcible.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

You clearly haven't educated yourself very well on the nature of End User License Agreements or their history of related court cases. To just make a blanket statement that the terms of the EULA are always uniformly enforceable when preceeded by a "click-wrap" or "shrink-wrap" agreement is plainly wrong. Going by your logic there could be a "return immediately after purchase" clause in the EULA legally compelling me to send my game back to the publisher without being reimbursed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/End_User_License_Agreement#Shrink-wrap_and_... Again, lower courts have decided things differently and there's no definitive Supreme Court case law on the subject.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

The only problem with that type of EULA is that you are unable to return games that contain provisions you don't agree with. You are not able to return software easily if you do not agree with the terms of the EULA.

If they want to make EULA's enforcable, they should make a way for us to review the EULA before purchasing or opening games.

E. Zachary Knight
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
MySpace Page: http://www.myspace.com/okceca
Facebook Page: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1325674091

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Uh, I own every single game I paid for. The physical case, disc, instructions, anything else that came with it are mine and mine alone, I am not borrowing, renting or licensing pieces of plastic and paper from the game's original publisher or anyone else. What you are saying is as stupid as claiming that you don't actually own that couch you just bought, you're just paying its maker for the privilege of sitting on it. In neither scenario does a "licensing agreement" factor anywhere into the equation; I didn't buy a patent or copyright, I bought a physical product.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

That's the common way consumers understand it, but unfortunatly it's not the way things are looked at in the legal venue. Like I said, rather then assuming based on what you feel is correct, actually go find out. I didn't make the laws I'm just reiterating them.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Actually, you haven't reiterated (or iterated, for that matter) any laws in regards to this. I'd be happy to see which laws you're referencing that inform me that the pieces of plastic I buy aren't actually mine, unlike the potato chips I buy, the televisions I buy, the vehicles I buy, or the shirts I buy. I'm familiar with the first-sale doctrine and there is no definitive Supreme Court case stating that the terms of the EULA [can] expressly invalidate or void it; there are conflicting lower federal court decisions which have gone both ways. Any attempt at legally enforcing terms of the EULA prohibiting resale would be easily challenged.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

hmm... i don't think of resell value when i purchase new games. i only buy games that i want to keep.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Well if companies did get a cut off of used games sales then Atari would be in a lot better shape.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Remember this!

 

Game companies believe they are selling you a non-transferable single use license, and until we force, in court, the casting down of the EULA, we will have more crap like this and DRM. You are NOT buying a product-you are buying a license, or so they say.

Of course, if you want your games free you can just mod your console, use a free matchmaking service other than XBL (Denying them that 5 a month), get an unlimited rental service, and knock yourself out.

But modchipping is illegal! You only own a license to that console, modifying it is against the law and acn result in jailtime regardless of intentions.

Gamers, support open source hardware. It's the choice between a closed, snail-shit market like we see with televisions, or a fast paced doom 2 to crysis every decade.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Hey GamePolitics,

Someone here at GamePolitics.com took the opportunity to comment on my Obama article--or, perhaps I should say, one paragraph of a three-page editorial.

It is true that enclosed in my editorial is a single paragraph dedicated to "reining in the used games market." It is also true that this paragraph was shortsighted and not anywhere near as well as thought out as it could've been, especially with implications for the market and government control. I will freely admit of my own volition that I did not fully grasp the implications of what I had written until some of the comments had come in. I admit this because I have realized that the full implications of the paragraph in question are the polar opposite of my beliefs. I do not support government control of our industry, nor is government control involved in any of my political beliefs. I'm an independent and a moderate who supported Obama through the primaries and the general election. I just happened to come up with a poor idea, is all.

How did the paragraph come about in the first place, then? Just an admittedly poorly thought-out ideological notion that if developers got a small bit of cash back from the used games market, it would provide them with less of an impetus to include DRM. That's it. No government control undertones or anything of the sort meant to be implied. To reiterate: it was a bad idea conjured up by a limited understanding of the scope of the implications of the idea, which never should've been written in the first place. If you were offended by this paragraph in any way, I apologize. Rest assured that if I could go back in time and rewrite the piece, I would eliminate that point entirely, for it doesn't accurately reflect my intent in any way, period.

But for the person in question here at GamePolitics to proclaim my piece "marred," in my opinion, is just as shortsighted as my paragraph on the used games market. This was a three page piece written with a simple message: that our industry is heading towards a crash, that we need some help and that maybe we could get some aid from the U.S. government in light of our current predicament. After all, I wouldn't have written this statement--"I'm not talking about a radical ally-making process here, but rather about establishing an open line of communication so that Obama and Congress will be more receptive to hearing about (and reacting upon positively) industry issues in the future"--if I had meant for that single paragraph on used games to reflect a notion of government control in one instance, let alone on behalf of the entire piece.

The paragraph in question is a trouble spot, true, but marred? I vehemently disagree. I don't think that a piece that asks for tax cuts for smaller developers like Double Fine Studios, tax cuts/more money for middleware developers, tax-deductible SDKs and putting an end to a rivalry that has done nothing but cost the taxpayers of this country money--not to mention how it gives this industry grief--can be marred by a single paragraph. I think that those ideas are to the very least conceptually strong and that they shouldn't be dismissed because of one poorly thought out paragraph that I admit error on.

So, I ask all of you: take a Sharpie marker in your mind and blot out that paragraph and the one other mentioning of that point, then re-read the piece, for those are the ideas that I stand by. Those are the ideas that are supposed to comprise and be the crux of my editorial, not that single paragraph. After all, if I had intended for that paragraph to be the crux of my editorial, I would've written an editorial about that, not as a single paragraph in passing.

I want to be clear that I don't want to stir anything up as a result of this, merely clear up a misunderstanding. I don't think ill of the author of the post, nor am I angry. I just want to clear the air and make sure that when people read this article, they know full well what my actual intent is and there are significantly meatier ideas to consider that are meant to be there, rather than debate over the one that I shouldn't have put in at all.

Sincerely,
Nick Michetti

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Nick, it is great to hear some clarification from you directly. I'm liking how we're getting responses to our replies from authors of these artictlces, it is great because it clears up misunderstandings and opens more discussion.

Unfortunatly, I don't see how it'd be possible to have such a form of giving any amount of a used title to the developers, the fact that this be nearly impossible to enforce (except to retailers by law). This still will likely have an adverse effect of artificial scarcity, since many developers will likely want to save costs and just hope for small revenue from people trying to grab rare titles that are no longer in production and will incline more to not give any cuts to developers/publishers.

I agree we need tax cuts but we also need to move further from insane budgets for titles that have money poured in just to make little back in return b/c of the lack of marketing or whatever. It is a highly competitive business and not everyone has the money to buy every title instantly, and the time frame for maximum profits is extremely short. No one except a few have enough cash to support every developer's work within a time frame that their shareholders would appreciate.

Thanks for coming here Nick to clarify.

 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No


Thanks for the clear up.  I thought it was prolly just an accident, but I enjoy the conversation and debates that came of it.

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Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Nick - I wrote today's commentary and, as always, I stand by it.

Yes, it was a lengthy piece that you wrote. And if you re-read what was posted here, you 'll see that I acknowledged that your article made some points and was thoughtfully written. This segment on used games caught my eye and I think it merited a response. It also provoked a bit of discussion, which is always a good thing.

For me, it did mar your piece. Your results may vary. But this is a hot button issue for GP, which is consumer oriented.

To be honest, I wouldn't have dissected your entire article here on GP for space reasons, so that was never an option. But I think that having your work taken seriously and having it subjected to informed criticism adds a certain legitimacy to what you write, don't you think?

Anyway, thanks for having the intestinal fortitude to weigh in.

-GP

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Job well done, Dennis.

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"Game on, brothers and sisters." -Leet Gamer Jargon

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"A Chrono Trigger is anything that unleashes its will or desire to change history!" -Gaspar

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

We are not blaming you, We make mistakes aswell

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Nick,

Thanks for coming by to clarify.

I would add that the idea of a bluebook isn't necessarily a bad one, but it shouldn't have government enforcement behind it and I think it would have trouble catching on.  If somebody's willing to pay $30 for a game on eBay, it's perceived as being worth $30, and it'd be tricky to change that perception.

The last quoted sentence, "We also need for developers to respect our tradition of the second hand market and have part of the mandate state that developers cannot use DRM to inhibit used sales," is actually a perfectly good point.  I don't have a problem with government intervention that PROTECTS consumers from predatory business practices (in Dennis's analogy, DRM would be equivalent to a device that won't let you sell your table or move it to a new house -- not a perfect analogy, but that's the basic idea).

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Hey Nick. Thanks for coming in and commenting. I was one of the people who came to your article and commented on it.

The article was very well thought out and interesting.

I agree strongly with the idea of better tax incentives for the games industy. this is something I am working on here in Oklahoma. I hope that one day Oklahoma will recognize the importance of hte games industry.

I hope that this will not ruin any notions you have about us or this website.

E. Zachary Knight
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
MySpace Page: http://www.myspace.com/okceca
Facebook Page: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1325674091

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

"...here in Oklahoma."

Holy [bleep]! How did that slip past me?

...

OK, soaked my head. I have a friend (somewhat) that lives in OK. I'll bet he'll be surprised.

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"Game on, brothers and sisters." -Leet Gamer Jargon

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"A Chrono Trigger is anything that unleashes its will or desire to change history!" -Gaspar

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Yard sales must be outlawed, Who knows how many companies are being grieviously harmed!!! Ever dollar spent at a yard sale is a dollar for terrorism!!!!!

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

We need to burn down the libraries, they're killing the publishing companies!

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Have to love those poorly thought out arguments.

Video games are special. They should be regulated in their second hand form unlike all other types of merchandise.

- http://socialistgamerreview.com ~ Because the Proletariat Plays Games Too.

- http://socialistgamerreview.com ~ Because the Proletariat Plays Games Too.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

So once noe more copies of a game are being produced, it should become impossible for anyone who wants a certain game to ever get it?

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

There are two used PS1 games that I am trying to obtain. One is Spyro 2, and the other is Twisted Metal: Small Brawl. While I have no problem supporting insomniac or incognito does anyone think they should make money off that purchase? I can't find the games new, none of my local game stores sell PS1 games as far as I know so I'm left with either the used game market or piracy. I won't be bothered with altering any of my playstations, and I'm not sure about using ROMS so piracy is pretty much out the window.

But should they continue benefitting from something they made oh so long ago that they won't continue making? Should auto makers reap benefits from people selling their used classic chrome cars that look oh so much nicer than most cars of today?

----------------------------------------------------

"What for you bury me in the cold cold ground?" - Tasmanian devil

---------------------------------------------------- Debates are like merry go rounds. Two people take their positions then they go through the same points over and over and over again. Then when it's over they have the same positions they started in.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

If the games industry itself were so paranoid about used game sales, then they'd USE the technology to make sure a game can only be played on one console.

---You are likely to be eaten by a Grue.

---You are likely to be eaten by a Grue.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Gamers would Rebel

if their 360 RR'd what then gamer complains that none of his game work

game companies: tough shit

gamers would literaly stop buying any games and only playing flash games, because they know that their 60 dollars will eventually have been for nothing

United we Stand, Divided we fall.

There have always been motherf*ckers, there will always be motherf*ckers, but what we can't do is let them control our motherf*cking lives. -John Oliver, December 1st, 2008

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Sony already built this technology into the PS3.

They just haven't turned it on.

Yet.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hookers and Ice Cream aren't free. http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/comics/stolen-pixels/5137-...

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

You know as well as I or anyone else knows that doing such a thing would kill the PS3 as a console overnight.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Agreed. The only reason I'm considering a PS3 is because of the blue-ray capability (But I'm seriously thinking just getting the Arcade 360 and getting the blue ray seperately, most of the games I been wanting are on both of them anyway.)

Hunting the shadows of the troubled dreams.

Hunting the shadows of the troubled dreams.

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

I can understand the developer/publshier getting a cut from game rentals but a blue book is just dumb as well as second hand sales.

 

Re: Writer: Obama Should Regulate Sales of Used Games... GP: No

Industry types - capitalists rent-seeking corporatists, all - who seek to restrict used game sales would interfere with the way markets work.

Fixed that for you. :p

 
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Poll

Is King right? Should all games adopt the free-to-play model?:

Shout box

You're not permitted to post shouts.
Matthew Wilsonit is a game worth playing if you have a pc/360/ps304/20/2014 - 9:34pm
MaskedPixelantehttps://twitter.com/IGLevine/status/457552538343325696 The Lutece Twins show up in some of the most unlikely of places.04/20/2014 - 2:44pm
Andrew EisenAs it happens, Chinatown Wars is the only GTA game I've played.04/19/2014 - 10:43am
Papa MidnightWith GTA5 (to date) failing to even provide indication of a PC release, I'm realising that this might be the first GTA game that I have not played (outside of Chinatown Wars) since the series inception.04/19/2014 - 8:14am
IanCSo im guessing a bunch of edutainment games, which a lot of people elsewhere are going gaga over, dot count as classics? Okay. If you don't mind me, i have a sudden urge to play Putt Putt....04/19/2014 - 6:15am
MaskedPixelantehttp://www.joystiq.com/2014/04/18/playstation-99-cent-sale-discounts-tokyo-jungle-super-stardust/ Weekend long PSN flash sale. So much stuff is 99 cents for the rest of the weekend.04/18/2014 - 5:59pm
Adam802http://www.polygon.com/2014/4/18/5627928/newtown-video-game-addiction-forum04/18/2014 - 4:14pm
Matthew Wilsonit is a video talking about why certain games/products/consoles do well, and others do not. he back it up with solid research.04/18/2014 - 3:56pm
Andrew EisenI'm not keen on blind links. What is it?04/18/2014 - 3:45pm
Matthew Wilsonthis is worth a whatch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyXcr6sDRtw&list=PL35FE5C4B157509C904/18/2014 - 3:43pm
MaskedPixelanteNumber 3: Night Dive was brought to the attention of the public by a massive game recovery, and yet most of their released catalogue consists of games that other people did the hard work of getting re-released.04/17/2014 - 8:46pm
MaskedPixelanteNumber 2: If Humongous Entertainment wanted their stuff on Steam, why didn't they talk to their parent company, which does have a number of games published on Steam?04/17/2014 - 8:45pm
MaskedPixelanteNumber 1: When Night Dive spent the better part of a year teasing the return of true classics, having their big content dump be edutainment is kind of a kick in the stomach.04/17/2014 - 8:44pm
Matthew Wilsonhttp://www.giantbomb.com/articles/jeff-gerstmann-heads-to-new-york-takes-questions/1100-4900/ He talks about the future games press and the games industry. It is worth your time even though it is a bit long, and stay for the QA. There are some good QA04/17/2014 - 5:28pm
IanCErm so they shouldn't sell edutainment at all? Why?04/17/2014 - 4:42pm
MaskedPixelanteNot that linkable, go onto Steam and there's stuff like Pajama Sam on the front-page, courtesy of Night Dive.04/17/2014 - 4:13pm
Andrew EisenOkay, again, please, please, PLEASE get in a habit of linking to whatever you're talking about.04/17/2014 - 4:05pm
MaskedPixelanteAnother round of Night Dive teasing and promising turns out to be stupid edutainment games. Thanks for wasting all our time, guys. See you never.04/17/2014 - 3:44pm
Matthew WilsonAgain the consequences were not only foreseeable, but very likely. anyone who understood supply demand curvs knew that was going to happen. SF has been a econ/trade hub for the last hundred years.04/17/2014 - 2:45pm
Andrew EisenMixedPixelante - Would you like to expand on that?04/17/2014 - 2:43pm
 

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