Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

April 30, 2009 -

The recent claim by Iowa State Prof. Douglas Gentile (left) and the National Institute on Media and the Family that "nearly one in ten" 8-18 year-olds shows signs of video game addiction was challenged this week by ESA CEO Michael Gallagher, who questioned Gentile's methodology.

Yesterday, NIMF boss David Walsh defended Gentile's research to GamePolitics. Gentile himself has now waded into the fray, telling incgamers that the ESA's attack on his sampling methodology was a "trick."

And that's not all Gentile had to say:

The ESA are trying to give the perception that there was something wrong with the study... [the ESA's criticism of the sample is a] trick the ESA is trying to get you to pick up on...

 

We're talking about pathological implications [of addictive gaming], we're measuring it on how it damages people to function in a healthy way, and how they start to injure their family and social relationships, their school work or their occupational work, and when we measure it that way (the same we would measure pathological gambling), you can't just have one of the symptoms, but rather more than half of the symptoms. There are 11 symptoms, and you have to report up to six of those symptoms.

Eight and a half percent of the surveyed gamers, across the sample, reported up to six of those symptoms, which, in medical terms means that they are pathological gamers.

incgamer also cites a letter from Iowa State to the ESA which defends Gentile's methodology. The researcher did admit to a mistake in his report which incorrectly tabs the survey's margin of error at 3%.


Comments

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

I would think that this guy has never really taken the critical note from the book Grand Theft Childhood.

And that would be, before you even try to do a study about Videogames, first you must understand what is NORMAL for people who play Videogames.

 

Therefore once when you find out what is normal, THEN you can look at the addictive natures and think are they serious or are they something that is normal for gamers.

 

You have to be really careful when drawing such conclusions because what is normal for one part of society is not normal for another part of society.

Like it is normal for kids to play Videogames, but it is not normal for people over the age of 60 to play videogames, but it does not mean that there is anything wrong with the 60 year olds...

Plus they always seem to focus on the kids, why not focus on the 20 year olds or the 30 year olds or even the 40 year olds who play Videogames and try to find some sort of way to tell the patterns of Videogames and how they can relate to those who watch TV.

 

THAT would be what I would be going if I was a Psychologist and wanting to understand what Videogames are.

 

Sadly. I don't think there are many psychologists who are able to take the time to do that...

 

And even if they did, I don't think there would be many news media people willing to listen to an accurate study that is not newsworthy.

 

 

 

TBoneTony

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

 

What a coincidence that he just defend his study just right after the news about the game addiction made a person go embezelling money? Yeah I think this guy probably read GP just like JT does.  He saw the article about the game addiction made a dude embezzled money.  He just doing this because he wants to use this case to help support the NIMF and his cause.

 

to Prof Gentile:

Why did you just defend this studies even though that one is flawed?  Remember this.  You said to the guy that studies has flaws.  Why are you now defending that flawed experiment?  Did the NIMF threaten you? Did they threaten to cut off fund for your studies? Did they use any violent threat? If they did, you have to take it to the police.  Hey, game addiction is different from drug addiction and gambling addiction.  Listen, video game are not the cause of bad thing, it's the mental problem people have. 

mikedo2007

 

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

This guy is a Craig Anderson cronie.  Anderson and his gang has never found a form of media that didn't have negative effects. 

 

http://www.popularculturegaming.com

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Soo, how long before we hear that the game industry is the same as the tobacco industry, IE they wouldn't be trying to refute this if there wasn't anything ot hide.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Wait? So it was just a study to measure something that he says he agrees that no one agrees even exists yet, on a scale of how harmful it is nya?

 

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

So everything is addctitive and bad for you.... step away from that bible!!

 


I am a criminal because I purchase media,I am a criminal because I use media, I am a criminal because I chose to own media..We shall remain criminals until Corporate stay's outside our bedrooms..


http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com


Copyright infringement is nothing more than civil disobedience to a bad set of laws. Let's renegotiate them.

---

http://zippydsm.deviantart.com/

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Doesn't pathological usually mean some kind of virus is involved?

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

I have been a gamer all my life and at points in my youth I would lie about gaming, replace school work with gaming, dream/daydream about gaming, and in many cases this affected my life negatively. However, never in my life have I thought myself to be addicted to games based on these facts. Escapism is what it was and it was based solely on my personality. I was diagnosed with ADD, about two years before it was popular, and nothing could pull my interest more than computer games (consoles were expensive, didn't have one till my teens). This something I regret now, but can see myself fully admitting to “game addiction” if asked. In my teens I discovered recreational reading. For about one year after I discovered two of my favorite authors I would lie about reading, replace school work with reading, dream/daydream about books, and in many cases this affected my life negatively. It wasn’t the games that inspired addiction it was myself as a irresponsible child. To much emphasis is put on external sources. Recreational reading, Television and other media are just as addictive as games. Based on my experiance, this seems like another in a long line of overreactions from an older generation coming in contact with new media.  

 

(I have of late, but wherefore I know not, lost all my keys...)

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

"a letter from Iowa State to the ESA which defends Gentile's methodology."

As if their logic was not flimsy enough, Iowa has offically negated any argument that had for being the gaming capitol of the world... No one who supports gaming would support such an obviously flawed study.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

There's one thing I do appreciate in this interview:

"When asked about the wording, and the use of "pathological gamer" as a term, Dr. Gentile simply said, "we use pathological because it's the proper medical term.  The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual never uses the word addiction, even with drugs.  It uses drug tolerance and drug dependence, and with gambling it uses pathological gambling because addiction, historically, has never been a proper medical term.""

I've always said there's no such thing as a videogaming addiction, and now I've got another reason to back it up.

---
The Mammon Philosophy

---
Fangamer

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Seems that this is a "fight or flight" response to being called out for his study.

Getting to the truth about game addiction is going to be a sticky affair- there is a TON at stake here.  First, if games are found to be addictive, then that is the END OF THE GAMES INDUSTRY.  period.  Those are very high stakes, and the ESA & game consumers in general will be fighting tooth and nail to stop this.   On the flipside are the anti-games groups that have failed at every other approach to legislate, censor, and/or ban games.  The addiction element is perhaps their last refuge, and it is fast becoming their best bet.

Even if you get somebody without an agenda doing a study on game addiction, they are doomed to be drawn into this culture war.  The real truth, if it even exists, will continue to be elusive.

Personally, I see the addiction element being the biggest threat to videogames ever.  If the general consensus becomes that games are addictive, then expect them to be outright banned for children and the entire medium being relegated to tobacco, alcohol, and porn.  In that case, the only games that will be made will be modern-day Gals Panic titles...

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

If they are gonna to label games as adictive someday, then everything else should be labeled as well, because there is anything that can´t be addictive if the user abuses of it.

Addiction can be a very specific term, but this people just love to enlarge it. Maybe that can be considered as adicttion as well.

The cynical side of videogames (spanish only): http://thelostlevel.blogspot.com/ My DeviantArt Page (aka DeviantCensorship): http://www.darkknightstrikes.deviantart.com/

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

On the other hand, if gaming is proved to be addictive, it still has to be proven to be harmful.

Alcohol is addictive and harmful, but it is only regulated.

Studies that prove that videogames are addictive may also be used to prove that TV is addictive. I know my wife screams bloody murder if she can't watch her shows. But TV will never be banned. If you strip entertainment from the masses, revolution will come swiftly.

The worst case scenario I see is another Comics Code Authority, which is now a joke. With the internet as a viable information exchange and marketplace, M rated games will never go away. They just won't be as good as they are now. And they'll be made in China.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

I have never heard the term addictive used to describe a non-harmful context. 

Also, if games are regulated like alcohol, it's far from "only regulated".  Imagine a world where anyone under 18 (or 21) is banned from playing videogames completely.  The only games available would be only be geared for adults, and the medium would be nothing more than a sleazy pasttime.  Leisure Suit Larry would be the pinnacle of this new game industry.

Also, a Comics Code-esque measure by the industry would do the same to games as it did to comics: stifle the creativity of the medium in a way that would take decades to overcome.  Even now, American comics are dominated by superhero stories.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Lost in this debate is "so what?".  Even if the numbers are accurate, all he's proved is almost 1 out of 10 parents can't do their job of limiting their kids playing time.  We're supposed to do what?  Stop making and playing games because of this?

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

I had a biology teacher that told us if you see a study that claims symptom or result A occurs less than 20%, ignore it. Anything less can be fudged by personal agendas, or reflect a non-average sampling pool. He says most results will fluctuate by up to 10% when the experiment is retried. 

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Hey prof, how about coming back to the fire when you have a study thats is not FLAWED!

http://www.magicinkgaming.com/

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Yeah, sorry, you've already admitted to a sampling error. In other words, your sample isn't representative of the USA.  You probably went to the nearest shrink (or maybe to some loser in Olganon) and asked them how many cases they had seen, then made up a number for the total sample.

Either way, your numbers are crap.  Your study is crap.  Your research is, thus, crap.  And if you spent 2 years of your life working on this, you should be ashamed.  If I took 2 years and came up with such bullshit, I'd quit and go shovel horse manure for the rest of my life.

Nice methodology; maybe if I get bored, I'll have some grad students try to replicate your shitty experiment and see what we come up with.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Smells like he got a call from Walsh saying "defend the faulty study or we cut you off from future funding."

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Sounds right.

That reminds me, I know a psych major who just finished taking her research methods course, I've been meaning to fire this story in her direction and see what she thinks of it.
---
I'm not under the affluence of incohol as some thinkle peep I am. I'm not half as thunk as you might drink. I fool so feelish I don't know who is me, and the drunker I stand here, the longer I get.


---
I'm not under the affluence of incohol as some thinkle peep I am. I'm not half as thunk as you might drink. I fool so feelish I don't know who is me, and the drunker I stand here, the longer I get.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

We're talking about pathological implications [of addictive gaming], we're measuring it on how it damages people to function in a healthy way, and how they start to injure their family and social relationships, their school work or their occupational work, and when we measure it that way (the same we would measure pathological gambling), you can't just have one of the symptoms, but rather more than half of the symptoms. There are 11 symptoms, and you have to report up to six of those symptoms.

Eight and a half percent of the surveyed gamers, across the sample, reported up to six of those symptoms, which, in medical terms means that they are pathological gamers.

What you're not talking about is a representative and unbiased sample. The sample you do have could very well have a margin of error of say... eight and a half percent.

That's ignoring the poll itself, which (if I recall the reports correctly) asks the same questions of 8 year olds as it would of gambling addicts, with the word "gambling" replaced with "videogames".

Given that 8 year olds generally aren't developed enough to be left alone to do chores around the house, I certainly wouldn't expect them to know how to manage their time in a balance manner.

-Gray17

-Gray17

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Bingo.  He's going on and on here about the "methodology", when he completely ignores all the damning evidence that's been revealed (and he acknowledged!) about the sampling.

Highly unprofessional.

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

And the conspirancy against the "protek the childrenz" people just gotten deeper... even when the commit mistakes and deny them, when somebody points their flaws, is "a trick"...

Assholes...

The cynical side of videogames (spanish only): http://thelostlevel.blogspot.com/ My DeviantArt Page (aka DeviantCensorship): http://www.darkknightstrikes.deviantart.com/

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

I sense a similarity to Jack in Gentile.

-----------------------------



"The sun will always rise tomorrow. We can only live for today, and hope more days will come." -Unknown

-----------------------------



"A Chrono Trigger is anything that unleashes its will or desire to change history!" -Gaspar

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

But Jack would never admit, "I made an error."

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Which is why I said he was similar to Jack, rather than just like him.

-----------------------------



"The sun will always rise tomorrow. We can only live for today, and hope more days will come." -Unknown

-----------------------------



"A Chrono Trigger is anything that unleashes its will or desire to change history!" -Gaspar

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

The big difference is he doesn´t hate games or gamers... yet.

The cynical side of videogames (spanish only): http://thelostlevel.blogspot.com/ My DeviantArt Page (aka DeviantCensorship): http://www.darkknightstrikes.deviantart.com/

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

That's true.

-----------------------------



"The sun will always rise tomorrow. We can only live for today, and hope more days will come." -Unknown

-----------------------------



"A Chrono Trigger is anything that unleashes its will or desire to change history!" -Gaspar

Re: Game Addiction Study Prof Fires Back at ESA Boss

Talk about flip-flopping! Gentile ADMITTED the study was flawed, and now he's defending it again! Get over it! You can't back out on the appology, so just count your losses and MOVE ON!

 
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Michael ChandraYou want a debate? Build a wall between you and the poisoned well. Make clear you despise it, despise the behaviour. Then get into the other issues you are troubled with, and don't say a single word again about the poisoned well.09/19/2014 - 3:46am
Michael ChandraAnd someone claiming #notyourshield was to be taken serious, when chatlogs show they wanted it going to hide even more harassment behind? Yeah, not buying a word you're saying. You poisoned your own well.09/19/2014 - 3:45am
Michael Chandraallegedly fired over giving a game a mediocre review and the company threatened to pull ads? Sorry but I ain't buying this.09/19/2014 - 3:45am
Michael ChandraBut people arguing this is horrible and just about ethics, even though there's very little support that journalistic integrity was actually violated here, while they never spoke up when a journalist was09/19/2014 - 3:43am
Michael ChandraIf people start with condemning the way GamersGate was used as a misdirection, then use a better hashtag, that would work in convincing me they mean it.09/19/2014 - 3:43am
Andrew EisenOoo, this one came down to the wire! https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/749082525/nefarious09/19/2014 - 1:03am
Andrew EisenI don't doubt that many are truly interested in journalistic integrity. The problem I'm often seeing is they seem to have no idea how or where to talk about it.09/18/2014 - 11:46pm
Andrew EisenDidn't word that well. Busy at work. I've seen people claim that GamerGate is solely about ethics and transparency in games journalism and then go on to show that what they're really after is silencing those who talk about gender issues in games.09/18/2014 - 11:45pm
Kronodebate. Becaus apparently people who only post on Reddit are supposed to police twitter before they're allowed to question anything about the people involved.09/18/2014 - 10:40pm
KronoI highly doubt many, if any are using journalistic integrity as a cover for harassment. The people harassing are essentially trolls. They aren't interested in subtle. More often it's othe other way around. People use "but X is being harassed" to shut down09/18/2014 - 10:38pm
Andrew EisenAnd exacerbating everything is the fact that all the cries of ethics violations have been obnoxious and easily proven false.09/18/2014 - 8:59pm
Andrew EisenProblem is, I would imagine, the sheer number of people who are using journalistic integrity as a cover for their harassing actions or only bringing it up on the false pretense of journalistic integrity.09/18/2014 - 8:47pm
Andrew EisenHaving said that, I can certainly see how one would be frustrated if they truly just wanted to talk about journalistic integrity and someone said they were one of the people harassing Sarkeesian, Quinn and others (though I've seen no examples of that).09/18/2014 - 8:44pm
KronoThat's been the common refrain, that talk of journalism ethics is just an excuse to harass people.09/18/2014 - 8:44pm
KronoLines like "like a partial compromise with the howling trolls who’ve latched onto ‘ethics’ as the latest flag in their onslaught against evolution and inclusion." are taring everyone questioning the ethics as a harasser.09/18/2014 - 8:43pm
Andrew EisenKrono - Except, none of the articles were talking about gamers complaining about journalist ethics, let alone called them white male misogynists. They were talking about the gamers who were harassing others.09/18/2014 - 8:36pm
Kronomakes plenty of sense. It's rather hard to dismiss someone as a white guy running a sock puppet when they've posted proof they're a woman, or black, or another minority.09/18/2014 - 8:32pm
Kronothat any critics of journalists were white guys that hated women, and could be dismissed as such. It seems to have helped some. It's kind of difficult to maintain the white guy narrative in the face of a bunch of women and non-white guys. So the tag09/18/2014 - 8:32pm
Kronothat, someone vented on a #gamergate 4chan thread about being dismissed like that. The suggestion they got in return was to organize their own hashtag in response, with #NotYourShield being suggested. Thus the tag came into use to combat the undercurrent09/18/2014 - 8:32pm
Kronomuch more general problem. And while several of the articles were fairly tame, they spured a bunch of people to dismiss any critics of the journalism involved as misogynistic men. Usually with insults aimed at the geek stereotype. After about a week of09/18/2014 - 8:32pm
 

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