Speaking recently at the XOXO Festival in Portland over the weekend, Tropes vs. Women in Video Games creator Anita Sarkeesian spoke out about the abuse and threats she has received in recent weeks. Sarkeesian said in her speech at the event (as detailed by the Verge) that many of the people that lob hate and threats at her and others online for their work do so because they believe they are being "noble."
"The perpetrators do not see themselves as perpetrators at all," she said. "They see themselves as noble warriors. We are blamed for the abuse we receive and regularly told that we are either asking for it or inventing it entirely."
Sarkeesian also talked about how "hate campaigns" are often spread through social media, and how facts are often lost in the fervor. By the time these campaigns reach a fever pitch, no one seems to know exactly what the truth is:
"Falsehoods about me are initially pushed by detractors who use them to post to 4Chan and Reddit to rally more people to the cause," she said. "It's bouncing from Twitter to Tumblr to Facebook to YouTube and back again. Once the cascade reaches a critical mass, it no longer matters what the facts are. It becomes a viral meme."
Sarkeesian produces a series of documentaries called Tropes vs. Women in Video Games, which highlights how games often put women in a poor light or generally treat them as objects or "window dressing."
Her latest video was released at about the same time that Depression Quest developer Zoe Quinn was being harassed and threatened via social media. Those taking aim at Quinn decided to take Sarkeesian to task as well. While some in the community simply criticized Sarkeesian for her latest video others took it a step too far by threatening and harassing her.
You can watch the latest video to your left. We don't think it contains anything that would warrant threats of violence or rape against Sarkeesian.
Source: Polygon



Comments
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Also it doesn't help when these same "gaming journalists" all meet up in a secret group that was discovered with screenshots to coordinate news story to push certain stories or agenda's like Biowares. The gaming news industry with payola is just asking to be regulated
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Gamergate is much more then her I am hoping you'll expand more on that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwFWsFUfnNQ&list=UUcnQGuLjq0sLR3ll1tMgQDA
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
First off, I like to say that I firmly believe feminism is a good thing, as (ideally) they are seeking equality. Though on the other hand, if they are trying to take over, and making women the "new men", I would not see it the same. And I feel the line drawn between that is, intentionally or otherwise, made blurry by feminists themselves.
But anyway, feminism for equality is good. A message that the ACG (anime, comics, games) community really needs to understand, especially the G's.
As for the videos themselves, I've only seen the very first video of the series (which now has 7, I just checked) and sort of skimmed the 2nd video. I gave up after that. Granted, I've looked at those back when they first came out, so memory is blurry.
There's a Chinese saying called "to pick out bones from inside an egg" which just means "nitpicky" is my view on her stance of the "sexism in video games issue".
Along with conveniently skipping over details on how "gender equality in video games" have improved over the years and focusing solely on things that could help her arguments with it though I hoped she did improve on this aspect in later videos.
Locking comments, which is totally understandable, but it shouldn't be done. Since that effectively gives the impression that she not accepting any criticisms for her arguments.
It doesn't help her already bad publicity on that art she "fairly used without crediting the creator" as well. But I'm rambling at this point.
You could say that my comments aren't valid because I should give her later vids. a watch, that's fine, I can totally accept that. This is just my opinion on what I've seen already, and for the time being, I have no plans to bother with her videos any further.
Ultimately, I don't know how Anita thinks and assuming she's not taking the feminists issue, lumping it together with video games just to troll us all, and she's actually fighting for what she's believing in, then I don't think it's a bad thing.
I might think her views are rather extreme, therefore I don't agree, at the same time, I support the fact that gaming community needs people like her...just less extreme maybe.
To the guys giving her death threats, stop, please. You have way better things to do, that much I guarantee.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
"...I firmly believe feminism is a good thing, as (ideally) they are seeking equality. Though on the other hand, if they are trying to take over, and making women the "new men", I would not see it the same."
Feminism is simply the belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities. That's it. So anyone pushing feminism for anything other than equality is not a feminist.
"...I've only seen the very first video of the series (which now has 7, I just checked)..."
Not that it matters but there are six. Damsel in Distress parts 1 - 3, Ms. Male Character, and Women as Background Decoration parts 1 and 2.
"Along with conveniently skipping over details on how "gender equality in video games" have improved over the years..."
That's not the focus or point of the first video so it doesn't really work as a criticism.
"...and focusing solely on things that could help her arguments with it though I hoped she did improve on this aspect in later videos."
Well, yeah. She uses examples of games that demonstrate the trope she's discussing. Nothing unseemly about that. Anyway, you'll be interested to know that she does talk about games that do or at least attempt to flip the script on common tropes and one of her upcoming videos will focus on examples of positive female characters in games.
"I might think her views are rather extreme, therefore I don't agree, at the same time, I support the fact that gaming community needs people like her...just less extreme maybe."
What "extreme views" are you seeing in her video?
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
My 2 cents
Sarkeesian has a point a shame she burries it in her hyperbole half the time.....
Copyright infringement is nothing more than civil disobedience to a bad set of laws. Let's renegotiate them.
---
http://zippydsm.deviantart.com/
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Please cite three examples of hyperbole from her TvW videos. Make sure to include the video title, direct quote and timestamp.
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
You keep saying that and when someone does, you ignore them.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Absolutely untrue. I just checked this article and the last one and, as of this writing, no one has cited a single example.
Here's proof:
http://www.gamepolitics.com/2014/08/27/tropes-vs-women-games-women-backg...
http://www.gamepolitics.com/2014/09/15/anita-sarkeesian-hateful-abuse-of...
http://www.gamepolitics.com/2014/09/15/anita-sarkeesian-hateful-abuse-of...
http://www.gamepolitics.com/2014/09/15/anita-sarkeesian-hateful-abuse-of...
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Anita is not an expert, a proper researcher, or really qualified AT ALL to make any of these statements, so taking them with a grain of salt is the bare minimum you can do. On top of that, a lot of her opinions and observations are very disagreeable and often detached from reality, but dressed up in faux-academic ideas.
I'm really quite disappointed that you'd even give her any attention on your site. She's not worth anyone's time.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Please cite three examples from her TvW videos that show poor research or opinions/observations that are detached from reality. Include the video name, direct quote and timestamp for each.
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Not 'faux academic' at all, they are not even her ideas. It is all pretty standard stuff.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
You seem to not be an expert, a proper researcher, or really qualified AT ALL to make any of these statements, so taking your comments with a grain of salt is the bare minimum we can do. On top of that, a lot of your opinions and observations are very disagreeable and often detached from reality, but dressed up in faux-academic ideas.
Glad we cleared that up. Now everyone can completely ignore you as you are not worth anyone's time.
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
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Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I know you're just trying to get him to see the invalidity of his criticisms. But you're being unreasonably harsh as well. Even if both of you are saying the exact same thing but directed at a different person, his is, in a way, more valid than yours, because he's at least attempting to criticize the fact that Anita made arguments.
In turn, you're just criticizing the fact that he's criticizing, which is pretty ad hominem to me.
Of course, I'm no expert, nor a proper researcher, nor really qualified AT ALL to make any of these statements, so take my comments with a grain of salt.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I know you're just trying to get him to see the invalidity of his criticisms.
Yes. Yes I am.
But you're being unreasonably harsh as well.
No more harsh than he is.
Even if both of you are saying the exact same thing but directed at a different person, his is, in a way, more valid than yours, because he's at least attempting to criticize the fact that Anita made arguments.
What criticism? His is a complete and utter rejection of everything she says simply because he has an opinion about the speaker. There is no attempt to form a valid counter to her comments.
In turn, you're just criticizing the fact that he's criticizing, which is pretty ad hominem to me.
Not at all an ad hominem.
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
Random Tower
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
No more harsh than he is.
Now, I'm not American, so I wouldn't know if "an eye for an eye" is the way you guys do things. But hear me out, that's no reason to even be harsh, it doesn't give anyone else to do "bad" just because a certain individual has done it already, especially someone of your status, E Zach, who is the admin of this site.
It's kind of like lashing out the exact same insults to a person a decade or two younger than you, sure, you're not "more wrong" on a metaphysical level than the other person, but it looks a lot worse on you than the other guy. Since you are expected to know better.
I'll say I agree with everything else you've said though. I'll give my opinion on a new post (because why not, I'm already here).
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I worked middle management in health insurance before the financial crisis. I received multiple death threats a week, and once had a fake bomb mailed to my office. Does this reflect poorly on the insured?
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
No, it does not beg the question. It raises the question.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Is she using the Royal We? Sarkeesian's gone off the deep end.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
"Is she using the Royal We?"
No, she's not. Clearly.
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
The problem is that she does not allow for a dialog, it's the same as a talking head show that has four liberals and one conservative or vice versa.
Hell not allowing for a real discussion already qualify's Anita for a show on FOX News or MSNBC.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I imagine she finds a bit of difficulty having a dialog with people screaming for her head on a pike because she has an opinion.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
She makes a few videos, and then she gets an undeserved shitstorm in response. Yet, she's to blame for a supposed lack of dialog?
Here's a thought: shut down all the mouth-breathers, the misogynists, the assholes making death threats, the people trying to shut/shout her down completely.
THEN we can see about dialog.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
It seems that the GamerGate crowd has indeed arrived.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
We can have a discussion here or countless other places and Sarkeesian isn't doing a thing to try and prevent us from doing so.
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I've yet to see a story here about the legions of gamers calling for greater transparency and integrity in games journalism. This is the closest thing to a mention of it GamesPolitics has made.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Speaking personally, I haven't seen anything worth covering. Kotaku and Polygon (was it Polygon? I think it was Polygon) updated their policies regarding reporters using Patreon and things of that nature but it never struck me as that interesting a story. Other than that, I have seen a bunch of anonymous internet users making unsubstantiated claims of shady ethics among game journalists but without anything concrete to write about, well, there's not much of a story.
Still, if there's something you'd like to see us cover, use the site's "Submit News" feature to send us a link(s).
Andrew Eisen
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Then you are not paying attention. I see the topic come up quite often even outside gamepolitics. It is a rather old discussion even among game journalists.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Game Politics has written many times about ethics in journalism. It is of interest to us. However, the latest controversy has been nothing of worth. it is retreads of past issues with a motive to attack and shame specific individuals rather than actually advance ethics.
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
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Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
How did you go about making that determination - that it possesses a "motive to attack and shame specific individuals rather than actually advance ethics?" There are thousands of us - i.e., the movement itself - that would disagree with you.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I determined that because the whole thing started as an excuse to attack and harass Zoe Quinn. If you deny that, you are either lying, or ignorant. I am sorry, but that is the truth.
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
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Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Why would that be the case? What's the goal there?
You mean to tell me, thousands upon thousands of people, some of them women, just get their jollies from insulting a woman? And that this manifests as a call for increased transparency and integrity, as thousands donated toward a feminist charity? And I'm ignorant?
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
The well is poisoned. How's the water taste?
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
You mean to tell me, thousands upon thousands of people, some of them women, just get their jollies from insulting a woman?
I don't believe I ever said that. What I said was to deny the roots of gamergate is to be a liar or ignorant. If you joined the movement because you feel that there is a lack of ethics in journalism, then fine. However, you are joining a tainted movement, one that many thousands of people are currently and actively using as a platform to harass and threaten people.
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
Random Tower
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
"Many thousands?" You're delusional.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Well, I am not the one denying the roots of gamergate.
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
Random Tower
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
US has roots in Slavery and Genocide. Do you use its Roots to form your opinion on it as well?
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Interesting retort. I don't deny slavery and genocide. My question is why do gamergate supporters deny its roots?
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
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Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
My guess would be, because people use its roots as a reason to dismiss the entire movement? Put yourself in the shoes of this hypothetical person who joined because of journalistic ethics or whatever. If every time you tried to talk about that, you were blown off by people pointing out some obviously heinous shit that some people did, but that you did not do and has nothing to do with what you're saying or your own reasons for supporting the movement, what would you do?
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Well, let's say there's this well, and somebody comes along and poisons it. Then you decide to drink from the well. Then you find out the well was poisoned, but shrug and invite others to drink from the well before grabbing another bucket for yourself.
Why should you be surprised when you find that there are people out there who know the well is poisoned and aren't going to drink from it? That they're wondering why you continue to drink from it?
Maybe it's time to find another well?
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
I don't think a well is a very good analogy at all, here. We're not talking about a single source for all these ideas, tainted or not. We're talking about myriad individuals, each with their own reasons for saying whatever they're saying.
In any case, that doesn't really have any bearing on my comment. EZK asked why they tried to deny those roots, and I offered a possible explanation. What you are talking about is whether the attempt to deny will be successful, not why the attempt is being made in the first place.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Look at #GamerGate on twitter. You can't dismiss it as a conspiracy theory with another conspiracy theory.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Yeah, that's an appropriate, proportional response...
"False"? So you get to tell actual women, actual minorities, that they aren't real? "#GamerGate" predates those logs considerably (unless you think actor Adam Baldwin, Jayne from Firefly, is a 4chan sockpuppet)
Answer me this, brosef - don't conspiracies usually have a goal? So, this secret cabal, this misogynist illuminati, gets thousands of people to come out in support of ethics, integrity and transparency, to protest sites like reddit engaging in censorship of dissent, fund a charity for women in the industry, and that's designed to hurt women...how, exactly? If you think disclosure of personal and financial relationships, if you think not having a racist make a living off calling you a misogynist, if you think keeping people from judging competitions in which they have a financial investment in a participant, if you think this "hurts women" - you're the misogynist, not us.
(beeteedubs, some of the most criticized people by #GamerGate are Ben Kuchera, Phil Phish, Jason Schrier, Stephen Totilo etc.. By all means, though, continue to cherry-pick, and maybe if you clap your hands and believe hard enough, it'll be true)
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
Disclosure of personal and financial relationships? Not judging competitions in which people have a financial investment? Nothing wrong there. I made that very clear with this: "I'd be willing to listen to arguments I likely would consider fair"
But as I ALSO made very clear: For many it appears to be nothing more than a disgusting excuse. The way you're accusing me of misogynism, shows to me that for you it ALSO is nothing but an excuse. If Quinn wasn't involved you wouldn't care at all.
There is only 1 relevant thing regarding GamerGate, and that is that it was used as a cover for a hideous attack, one that you haven't had the balls to condemn. Read this article and acknowledge your wrongs, and stop pretending death threats are fine as long as it's part of a political agenda, and I will bother believing you actually believe the stupidity you spout. http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-things-i-learned-as-internets-most-hated-p...
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
You're the one slinging insults here - think about that.
As I mentioned elsewhere in this thread, I used to work middle-management for a healthcare company. I received death threats several times a week, even had a bomb mailed to my office. Now, would you argue that people with insurance have to take responsibility for that, have to come out and condemn it before any of their grievances about insurance can be taken seriously? What about muslims? Do you insist that every muslim you meet apologize for 9/11 before criticizing anything about America?
I'm not going to apologize for threats and harassment because I don't threaten and harass people.
Disclosure of personal and financial relationships and recusal in competition-judging are the biggest issues in #GamerGate. Hell, with the exception of some outliers, that is the totality of the movement.
I do not, and have never, given two shits about Quinn. I saw that business with her and Wizardchan pop up on reddit, had a chuckle, and moved on. What got me involved in #GamerGate was a little while later seeing TWENTY THOUSAND comments deleted in a thread linking to TotalBiscuit having a fair, even-handed, middle-of-the-road discussion about it. That's what got me involved. Seeing people who suddenly stop giving a shit about censorship when it's opinions they dislike, seeing people like documented racist Leigh Alexander (author of a sizable portion of anti-GG pieces) threaten the careers of dissenters, seeing major, formally-respectable news outlets like VICE fail to do basic fact checking and letting people with obvious conflicts of interest report on the GG story, seeing the OVERWHELMINGLY straight, white, heterosexual male gaming press deny the existence of, then insult and denigrate when confronted by, women and minorities who support #GamerGate, that's what got me mad.
The totality of your position hinges, depends on the idea that all of us, even the women, even the trans, even the minorities, are all actually secret misogynists working to bring down women in gaming. It hinges on donating money to feminist charities being a single move on a great, hidden, misogynist chess board. It hinges on the random shitheads on the internet that exist in every movement being the core of #GamerGate. It hinges on people like boogie2988 being personally and professionally threatened for supporting #GamerGate to not exist. It hinges on people like Zoe Quinn supporting individuals bribing people with beta keys to post hate on the hashtag not existing ( https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BxlGZL5CQAE0bEm.png:large ). It depends on this man (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Tkto-HtXqg8 ) being a liar/not existing.
It depends, fundamentally, on willful ignorance.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
So basically you jumped on a hoax and are now using criticisms of the hoax as a straw man to claim that because a diverse group of people got fooled into attacking someone that misogyny was never behind it.
There have been plenty of instances of the gaming press getting caught with financial improprieties and people annoyed about them, but somehow this movement did not get energy behind it till it got to slut shame some woman by linking into the narrative that women will use sex to advance above their station.
Also, hate to break it to you, but women, trans, gays, etc, can be just as misogynistic as strait white males. Some of the most sexist people I have encountered were 2nd wave feminists, the trans community are constantly at each other's throats, and gay activism is just as filled with sexism and racism as the hetro-cis one, not to mention subgroups who try to figure out which allies they can sell out next in order to show conservatives that they hate the same people they do.
So having a bunch of minorities in a movement changes nothing.
Re: Anita Sarkeesian: 'Hateful Abuse' Often Comes From ...
It s hard to take you seriously when you post hilarious comments like this:
seeing people like documented racist Leigh Alexander (author of a sizable portion of anti-GG pieces)
E. Zachary Knight
Divine Knight Gaming
OK Game Devs
Random Tower