Video Game Research

Games Not a Major Factor in Newsweek's In-Depth Report on Violence

July 2, 2008

The current issue of Newsweek devotes five pages to a feature called "Anatomy of Violence."

Perhaps surprisingly, video games come in for only a scant mention near the bottom of the last page:

No discussion of violence in American culture is complete without mentioning blood-soaked videogames. Right after earning points for a graphic disemboweling, young players are more aggressive, but more in punch-little-sister mode than shooting up a mall. Still, there is evidence that violent games have a numbing effect. "When people stop feeling it's terrible that someone is getting hurt, that's dangerous," says [a researcher].

So, if not violent video games, what is causing violence in American society?

Scientists who study criminal violence... now believe that its roots are equally planted in the biology of an individual, the psychology that reflects the interaction of innate traits and experiences, and the larger culture. No single cause is sufficient, none is deterministic...

 

Louis Schlesinger, professor of forensic psychology at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York, mass killers tend to be aggrieved, hurt, clinically depressed, socially isolated and, above all, paranoid.

Definitely worth a read if you have an interest in the topic...

Islamophobia? Video Game Study Suggests "Turban Effect"

July 1, 2008

Do turban-wearers provoke subconscious prejudice against Muslims?

As reported by the Victoria Times-Colonist, a study conducted at the University of New South Wales in Australia suggests that Muslim-style turban are perceived as menacing. Researchers there are calling this the "turban effect". The results of the study will be published in an upcoming issue of the Journal of Experimental Social Psychology. From the Times-Colonist article:

Research volunteers played a computer game that showed apartment balconies on which different figures appeared, some wearing Muslim-style turbans or hijabs and others bare-headed. They were told to shoot at the targets carrying guns and spare those who were unarmed, with points awarded accordingly.

 

People were much more likely to shoot Muslim-looking characters - men or women - even if they were carrying an innocent item instead of a weapon, the researchers found

At this point, it's unknown what game software was used for the study. Mohamed Elmasry, head of the Canadian Islamic Congress, commented on the results:

I'm hoping that Canadian Muslims one day become invisible. As such, Canadians will treat them like any others... [The research] does confirm our biggest fear that there is discrimination and prejudice within our society, and unfortunately people don't recognize it or don't admit it. Sometimes they really don't know that it does exist.

Via: Discrimination and National Security Initiative Blog

Grand Theft Childhood Authors Respond to U of Michigan Prof's Criticism

June 30, 2008

In the preceding GamePolitics article we covered University of Michigan Professor Brad Bushman's criticism of Grand Theft Childhood.

The book, written by Harvard researchers Lawrence Kutner and Cheryl Olson, downplays the effects of video game violence on adolescent behavior.

We also contacted the authors for comment on Bushman's attack on Grand Theft Childhood. Dr. Cheryl Olson shared these thoughts (and provided several of the links):

I don’t mind other researchers criticizing my work as long as they don’t engage in personal attacks... Brad Bushman is absolutely entitled to air his views.

 

Unfortunately, Dr. Bushman has some of his facts mixed up. In the 2001 Surgeon General’s report on youth violence, exposure to TV violence was actually near the bottom of the list of influences on real-world violence – so low that it was relegated to an appendix!

 

He theorizes that teens are more likely to identify with video game characters than TV or movie characters. That’s plausible, but I could just as easily argue the opposite; boys told us repeatedly in focus groups that they enjoying taking the bad guy role in a video game specifically because they don’t want to behave that way in real life. Also, because video games require active control and participation, players are constantly reminded that the game is merely a game.

 

Dr. Bushman’s statement that video games directly reward violence is only partly accurate; anyone who actually plays video games knows that players are not always rewarded for acting violently, and in fact are often penalized immediately or later on (even in parts of Grand Theft Auto IV). The content and consequences in video games are extremely varied, which is one reason that studying their influence is so difficult.

 

Finally, regarding his experimental study of Dutch teenagers playing a game for 20 minutes in a lab: Those teens are fully aware that no researcher will allow them to act in a way that causes permanent physical harm to someone. Dr. Bushman may be a bit too credulous – a view that is supported by a quote from that Surgeon General’s report.

Co-author Dr. Lawrence Kutner added:

Game Violence Researcher Rips Grand Theft Childhood Book

June 30, 2008

While Lawrence Kutner and Cheryl Olson's recent book Grand Theft Childhood has given cheer to video gamers (and the video game industry), a longtime media violence researcher strongly disagrees with the authors' conclusion that violent games aren't all that bad for younger players.

In an op-ed for the Detroit Free Press, University of Michigan professor Brad Bushman writes:

Kutner and Olson’s advice to parents is particulary puzzling since their own data suggest that such games are linked to aggressive behavior... Although laboratory experiments can be used to establish cause-effect relationships, they quickly dismiss most lab studies as artificial and invalid.

 

I strongly disagree. Consider a laboratory experiment I recently conducted... Boys about 14 years old were randomly assigned to play a violent or nonviolent video game for 20 minutes... Next, they completed a noise blast task, with the winner blasting the loser with a noise...

 

The boys were told that inflicting higher noise levels could cause “permanent hearing damage” to their partners... These boys were even willing to give another boy noise levels loud enough to cause permanent hearing damage...

 

Violent video games are not the only risk factor for aggression, or even the most important factor, but they are definitely not a trivial factor...

Bushman was among the authors of the American Psychological Association's 2005 resolution which held that there is an increase in aggression following violent video game play. Bushman also participated in a 2007 study which found correlation between violent Biblical passages and aggression. He is also one of controversial Miami attorney Jack Thompson's expert witnesses in an Alabama lawsuit alleging that an 18-year-old's murder of two police officers and a dispatcher was motivated by playing Grand Theft Auto.

Survey Says: Gamers Drop $30K Between 18-48

June 24, 2008

Gamers spend about $30,000 on games and hardware between 18-48, according to data released this morning by GameStrata.

The provider of online tools and statistical data surveyed North American gamers. Of the results, GameStata exec Barry Dorf said:

The overwhelming majority of gamers are spending their time online with friends, building their reputation and online personas. Video games are becoming so much more than a momentary diversion; gaming is becoming yet another means of community building...

 

GameStrata also reaches some interesting conclusions concerning digital downloads:

A strong correlation between the frequency of digital purchases and Xbox 360 ownership suggests that the Xbox 360 is the preferred console for the consumption of digital content... The move toward the microtransaction revenue model is also a notable trend, with 85% of respondents confirming the purchase of a virtual good in the last month.

Via: GameWire

Teaching with Game Tech Powers Up Algebra Scores

June 16, 2008

A study at the University of Central Florida has found that using educational video games can increase students' math skills and raise standardized testing scores.

As reported by the journal, 193 algerbra and pre-algebra students from Orange County participated in the experiment. Those who played the games over an 18-week period did better on district-wide benchmark testing than those who did not. Students using the games improved their scores by 8.07 points on average, while those in the control group improved by just 3.74 points.

Tabula Digita's DimensionM games (screenshot at left) were used in the study. Company CEO Ntiedo Etuk commented:

These research results are remarkable and support previous studies which have concluded that interactive games are more effective on learners' cognitive gains than traditional classroom instruction alone. We are teaching a new generation of students, which requires unconventional teaching strategies be put into practice in the classroom. And when schools use our games, the student benefits speak for themselves--a greater desire to learn and higher test scores.

 

Shrink: WoW Addicts Feel More Shame Than Porn Addicts

June 9, 2008

Sunday's Boston Globe offers a fascinating interview with Oregon psychiatrist - and GamePolitics reader - Dr. Jerald Block, who specializes in treating online game addiction.

Block believes that "Internet Addiction" should be recognized as an official diagnosis.

From the story:

[Block] believes that psychiatry needs to do a lot of catching up in order to understand why people get stuck in games like Warcraft. One problem: Most therapists have no idea what a "guild" is or what it means to hit Level 60. Because of this language barrier, many gamers wind up begging for help in online support groups rather than seeking out mental health professionals.

Interestingly, Block said that addicted gamers feel worse about their habit than those addicted to pornography:

BLOCK: ...the computer gamers tend to be harder to treat. People feel a lot of shame around computer games. Whereas, it's socially acceptable to have a porn problem.

IDEAS: You can't be serious. You mean your clients are more ashamed of ...

BLOCK: ...playing World of Warcraft than looking at porn. Yes.

IDEAS: Why?

BLOCK: As a society we understand that porn is something people do, and you can see a psychiatrist and get treated for it. But gaming is hard to describe to anyone else. So these people can't explain their situation to friends. In fact, it's hard to give you an example of what my clients talk about, because gaming is enormously complicated.

Block has also studied the relationship between violent games and school shootings, but believes the issue is complex and enmeshed in the shooters' "relationship" with their PCs:

With these shooters, their last act was to turn against their own computers. As a psychiatrist, I think that's relevant.

 

Games Are a Guy Thing, Say Researchers

May 27, 2008

New research says that video games appeal to the male urge to conquer, according to a report in the Daily Mail.

The newspaper cites a new study by Stanford Prof. Allan Reiss (left), published in the Journal of Psychiatric Research

Professor Allan Reiss, who led the research, said women got the hang of the game and understood how to win the most territory, but were not as driven as men...

 

After analysing the MRI data, the researchers found participants of both sexes showed activation in the brain's mesocorticolimbic centre, the region typically associated with reward and addiction. Male brains, however, showed much greater activation. The amount increased as they gained more territory.

Reiss commented on his research:

These gender differences might help explain why males are more attracted to, and more likely to become "hooked" on, video games than females. I think it's fair to say that males tend to be more intrinsically territorial. It doesn't take a genius to figure out who historically are the conquerors and tyrants of our species.

 

Rocket Science: Games Don't Cause Crime, May Be Key to Education

May 19, 2008

A NASA researcher speaking at a University of Manitoba workshop discussed using video games as an educational tool and disputed supposed links between games and criminal behavior.

As reported by the Truro Daily News, NASA's Daniel Laughlin said:

Since 1993, violent crime in Canada and the U.S. has declined by 50 per cent and during that time the video gaming industry has exploded. If video games were really linked to crime, then we wouldn’t have seen that decline in violence.


Laughlin is the learning technologies project manager at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Baltimore. The space agency is working on an MMO to sharpen math and science skills among high school and college students:

I’d love to see a space-based game where the players are placed in real careers — astrophysicists, aerospace engineer. It would be a game where you need the expertise of real science to succeed... It’s got to be fun, first. Without the fun, no one will want to play it and it won’t be successful. But it has to use real science.

 

Researcher Sees "Grand Theft Rationality" in GTA IV Controversy

May 19, 2008

Texas A&M professor Christopher Ferguson pens an op-ed on the Grand Theft Auto IV controversy for the Eureka Reporter:

Violent video games do not cause violent behavior. There are no good data at all to suggest that they do.... as the consumption of violent video games in our society has skyrocketed, violent crimes, including those among youths, have plummeted... We can be sure that violent video games are not sparking a youth violence epidemic because there is no youth violence epidemic.

 

In my own research, I have found that family violence exposure as a child and the individual’s innate (probably genetic) personality are related to violent criminal behaviors, but that violent video game exposure is not...

 

we need to give the current generation of youths more credit. Today’s youths are healthier in most respects than any other group of youths since the 1960s. Today’s youths are less likely to engage in violent crime, use drugs or alcohol, get pregnant, commit suicide or drop out of school than were youths of previous generations.

UK Study: Kids Share Adult Concerns Over Violent Games

May 17, 2008

A new UK study indicates that two-thirds of British 12 to 15-year-olds believe playing violent video games makes them more aggressive.

The information is contained in a report on UK childrens' media literacy conducted by "media regulator" Ofcom. While the video game data comprises only one segment of the report, it drew the headlines in UK newspapers the Daily Mail and the Telegraph.

From the report's executive summary:

Children’s views on gaming are particularly interesting. Around two-thirds of older children agree that violence in games affects people’s behaviour outside the game and that violence in games has more impact on people’s behaviour than violence in television or films. There are high levels of agreement for having settings on consoles which can restrict game playing based on age ratings.

 

Although research to date has failed to prove conclusively a link between violent games and violent behaviour in children, children themselves clearly share the wider public concern around this issue. A possible factor in this is the high ongoing level of media coverage of violent crimes in which game playing is alleged to have been a factor.

 

Researcher: Violent Video Games Do Not Lead to Criminal Behavior

May 15, 2008

A researcher at England's University of Essex says that there is little evidence to suggest that video games are harmful. Patrick Kierkegaard, writing in the current International Journal of Liability and Scientific Enquiry, adds that, in his view, games do not lead to aggression.

He also suggests that previous studies linking games and aggression are biased.

As reported by Science Daily:

Kierkegaard explains... there is no obvious link between real-world violence statistics and the advent of video games. If anything, the effect seems to be the exact opposite and one might argue that video game usage has reduced real violence.

As others have done, Kierkegaard cites declines in US juvenile crime at the same time that video game sales are increasing:

Violent crime, particularly among the young, has decreased dramatically since the early 1990s. With millions of sales of violent games, the world should be seeing an epidemic of violence. Instead, violence has declined.

 

Kierkegaard said that the inherent bias found in many studies indicates a need for more details research on video games and their effects on youthful players.

Researcher: What GTA IV Gets Right About Gangs

May 12, 2008
Writing for Slate, Sudhir Venkatesh, a professor of sociology and African-American studies at Columbia University and the author of Gang Leader for a Day: A Rogue Sociologist Takes to the Streets, discusses the portrayal of underworld relationships in Grand Theft Auto IV:
I found that Grand Theft Auto actually offered a less sensational portrait of gangland and ghetto streets than the one put out by most cops, politicians, policymakers, and even academics. There is nuance in the game that exceeds most of the conventional portraits of American cities...

Not that I'm suggesting that we turn to GTA IV to solve the gang problem...  The game is a carnival of violence, deceit, and cruelty that makes you slightly nauseated after playing for only a few hours... But I have to admit that I was surprised a video game had such a well-developed, fine-grained understanding of human nature.

The game's success can be traced to a simple principle: Niko Bellic, the protagonist who roams around Liberty City, making his way in the world by building relationships... the point is that a lone wolf can't survive. Niko has to take a risk and trust somebody...

Video: Full Spectrum Warrior Mod is Therapy for Traumatized Iraq War Vets

May 12, 2008
The New Yorker serves up a video which details how THQ's hit strategy game Full Spectrum Warrior was modified to help Iraq War veterans deal with post-traumatic stress syndrome (PTSD).

The video accompanies an six-page article by Sue Halpern in the May 19th issue. Halpern also narrates the video. From the article:
Most P.T.S.D. therapies that we’ve seen don’t seem to be working, so what’s the harm in dedicating some money to R. & D. that might prove valuable?” Paul Rieckhoff, the executive director of Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America, said last November.

In January, his group issued a lengthy report called “Mental Health Injuries: The Invisible Wounds of War,” which cited research suggesting that “multiple tours and inadequate time at home between deployments increase rates of combat stress by 50%.”

Rieckhoff went on, “I’m not someone who responds to sitting with some guy, talking about my whole life. I’m going to go in and talk to some dude who doesn’t understand my shit and talk about my mom? I’m the worst of that kind of guy. So V.R. therapy, maybe it will work. We’re a video-game generation. It’s what we grew up on. So maybe we’ll respond to it.”

Leland Yee, Parents Television Council React to FTC Ratings Report

May 9, 2008
We've got additional reactions to yesterday's report by the Federal Trade Commission which gave high marks to the video game biz for its enforcement of ESRB ratings at point-of-sale.

A spokesman for State Senator Leland Yee (D), architect of California's contested video game law, remarked:
The Senator is pleased and commends retailers for significantly improving on the latest FTC study.  Clearly retailers are much more cognizant of the potential harmful effects of ultra violent video games and are not selling such games to minors in as great a number. 

With that said, it is imperative that the industry does more to prevent the sale of adult oriented games to children. Twenty percent of minors can still easily get their hands on games that are inappropriate for them. That equates to hundreds of thousands of children who are potentially in harm's way. The Senator looks forward to continuing his efforts and working with the various interested parties to end the sale of extremely violent video games to children.

Meanwhile, Gavin McKiernan, National Grassroots Director of the Parents Television Council, lauded GameStop for its 94% enforcement record, but said that, as a whole, the video game industry needs to do better:

We've Got Reactions to FTC Secret Shopper Report

May 8, 2008

The steep decline in sales of M-rated games to underage buyers reported this morning by the Federal Trade Commission is a clear victory for the video game industry on both the political and public relations fronts.

Taking a victory lap is the organization responsible for operating the video game industry's rating system, the ESRB. Via press release, ESRB president Patricia Vance commented on today's FTC report:
 

Video game retailers have clearly stepped up their efforts to enforce their store policies, and they deserve recognition for these outstanding results.  We commend and applaud retailers for their strong support of the ESRB ratings, and will continue working with them to help ensure that these levels of compliance are sustained if not further increased.


The ESA, representing US video game publishers, declined to comment, referring us instead to the ESRB.

Bo Andersen, president of the Entertainment Merchants Association, a trade group representing a number of video game retailers, also weighed in. For retailers, the report is a mixed bag. They scored superb numbers on game rating enforcement, but were criticized by the FTC for sales of R-rated and unrated DVDs to underage buyers. Andersen said:
 

Retailers don’t want children to be able to purchase or rent video games and DVDs that their parents do not want them to have. As a result, they have made real and significant investments in enforcing the voluntary video game and motion picture ratings in their stores. The FTC’s latest ‘undercover shopper’ survey demonstrates that these investments are producing strong results... While we are pleased with the progress that has been made in ratings enforcement, retailers still are not where they want to be as an industry.


On the consumer side, Hal Halpin, president of the Entertainment Consumers Association, remarked:
 

This is an extraordinary accomplishment from the nation's leading interactive entertainment retailers, as it clearly shows their increased commitment of keeping mature-rated games out of children's hands. Perhaps most impressive is the incredible reversal in their failure rate over such a short period of time and with a comparatively new rating system.

This is truly a vindication for video game merchants who have been falsely damned by anti-game advocates and special interest groups, who now don’t have a leg to stand on.


GamePolitics also offered several high-profile game industry critics and watchdog groups an opportunity to comment. So far we've not heard back from the Parents Television Council, the National Institute on Media & the Family or California State Sen. Leland Yee. There was one critic we did hear from, though...

Despite the eye-popping retail enforcement numbers, anti-game activist Jack Thompson refused to give credit to the video game industry. Instead, he credited... Jack Thompson:
 

I'm more than happy to take credit for the improvement. The threat of legislation has improved performance, not some altruism on the part of the Strauss Zelnick's [or] the industry. To America's parents: Jack Thompson is delighted to have helped.


Of course, Thompson would have been all over the FTC numbers had they been unfavorable to the video game industry. Classy, Jack...

UPDATE: Dr. David Walsh of the National Institute on Media & the Family has now weighed in. NIMF claims a bit of the credit as well:
 

The results of the [FTC's] latest undercover survey are good news for retailers and the [ESRB], but most of all for parents... With its consistent pressure on the video game industry, [NIMF] played a significant role in improving ratings enforcement and education. Similar to our... Video Game Report Cards, the FTC survey shows that specialty retailers, such as GameStop, continue to lead in enforcement and the rental companies need to step up their efforts...


Full Disclosure Dept: The ECA is the parent company of GamePolitics

Glenn Beck: Video Game Bloggers Are "Losers"

May 5, 2008
Socrates, Plato, Aristotle... Morons!

N'Gai Croal, Brian Crecente, Stephen Totilo... Losers!

So sayeth Glenn Beck, anyway.

Beck exploited the popularity of the Grand Theft Auto IV phenomenon again this evening. It was Beck's second GTA IV-themed segment in the last few days.

GamePolitics readers will recall that Beck allowed Jack Thompson to smear the ESRB and several major retailers last week without once advising his CNN Headline News audience that they were listening to a lawyer facing possible disbarrment.

Dr. Cheryl Olson, co-author of Grand Theft Childhood was Beck's guest this time. She was quite reasonable, but Beck made faces during certain parts of her commentary.

The highlight of the segment came when Beck played the role of the martyr:
I will tell you that all these video gamers... they're bloggers, as well as video gamers - they're writing all kinds of stuff about me [that] I'm the enemy now of video gamers. I could care less about video games. Video game bloggers? They're losers...

UPDATE: Mark Methenitis, an attorney who pens the excellent Law of the Game blog, has written an open letter to Glenn Beck regarding Jack Thompson's appearance.

Tivo Alert: Grand Theft Childhood Authors on Glenn Beck Tonight

May 5, 2008
Last week we were treated to Jack Thompson's view of Grand Theft Auto IV on the Glenn Beck program.

This evening we'll hear what should be quite a different perspective as Drs. Cheryl Olson and Lawrence Kutner, authors of Grand Theft Childhood: The Surprising Truth About Violent Video Games will appear on Beck's show.

(CNN Headline News, 7PM & 9PM).

GP on MN Public Radio Today... Globe & Mail Has Live Chat with Grand Theft Childhood Authors

May 1, 2008
Along with DePaul University game design professor Robin Burke, I'll be discussing Grand Theft Auto IV on Minnesota Public Radio's Midmorning with Kerri Miller today. The show airs at 10:00 AM Central.

Meanwhile, Drs. Cheryl Olson and Lawrence Kutner, the authors of Grand Theft Childhood: The Surprising Truth About Violent Video Games, will appear on a live chat with the Globe & Mail at 12:00 PM Eastern.

As GTA IV Launches, Harvard Med School Author Advises Parents: Relax

April 28, 2008
Today's Seattle Post-Intelligencer features a front page article on GTA IV which includes an interview with one of the authors of Grand Theft Childhood: The Surprising Truth about Violent Video Games.

Authors Lawrence Kutner and Cheryl Olson are both members of the Harvard Medical School faculty and the recently-released book has been widely acclaimed by the video game community for its reasonable - and unqiue - perspective on video game violence.

Kutner told the P-I:
For most kids and most parents, the bottom-line results of our research can be summed up in a single word: Relax... We have a long history of panicking over the introduction of new media. We have no evidence this is different.

The real question is which kids if any are at significant risk, and can we use behavior involving violent video game play as markers as what kids [should watch].

If you're looking for more of Kutner's thoughts, the Toronto Star has an excerpt of Grand Theft Childhood in today's edition.

The Post-Intelligencer story also features interviews with a concerned parent, as well as with What The Play editor John Davison and Hilarie Cash, author of the upcoming book Video Games & Your Kids: How Parents Stay in Control.

GP: Big thanks to GamePolitics reader Phantom for the tip!

GamePolitics ShoutBox

Posted 07/20/08 at 07:08pm
GRIZZAM PRIME: -he's disbarred. I was thinking Leland Yee, since he has actual medical credentials and all, not to mention political power.
Posted 07/20/08 at 07:03pm
GRIZZAM PRIME: Well shadow, every time I look at the shoutboard I see JT over and over, and I'm wondering who'll be spoken of the most when
Posted 07/20/08 at 06:59pm
Shadow Darkman Anti-Thesis of : Point of relevancy there Grizzam? j/w
Posted 07/20/08 at 06:48pm
GRIZZAM PRIME: So, in the future, who's initials will we use the most? LY(Leeland Yee)?
Posted 07/20/08 at 03:52pm
Shadow Darkman Anti-Thesis of : @PHOENIXZERO: IDK, why don't you ask him over e-mail?
Posted 07/20/08 at 01:47pm
Silencets: I might miss JT when he's disbarred.....nah I won't
Posted 07/20/08 at 11:45am
PHOENIXZERO: I wonder how many times Jack has seen The Dark Knight so far....
Posted 07/19/08 at 11:32am
Rodrigo Ybáñez García: Don´t you think that maybe Fat Princess will generate a lot of controversy?
Posted 07/19/08 at 08:46am
Paul T. Farinelli: To say that he did say it seriously, considering all of the rhetoric that he's spewed before.
Posted 07/19/08 at 08:45am
Paul T. Farinelli: Apparently it was a joke on JT's part. He acts as though we all should've realized that, but it's not to big of a stretch
Posted 07/19/08 at 07:14am
LuNaTiC: JT was not loved as a child. What jack ass forgot to pull out when creating this abomination??
Posted 07/18/08 at 10:32pm
Paul T. Farinelli: Seriously, i haven't been so awe-struck by someone's sheer audacity in...ever!
Posted 07/18/08 at 09:45pm
Shadow Darkman Anti-Thesis of : And I can take "No" for an answer.
Posted 07/18/08 at 09:45pm
Shadow Darkman Anti-Thesis of : JT is such a tool. He thinks he can have his way just because he's a Christian. Listen up, Jackie-boy, I'm a Christian, too.
Posted 07/18/08 at 09:09pm
Paul T. Farinelli: Also, I must say that Jack honestly looks like a serial killer in that pic. (not saying he is one, just that he looks creepy)
Posted 07/18/08 at 09:08pm
Paul T. Farinelli: Jace was apparently polite.
Posted 07/18/08 at 09:07pm
Paul T. Farinelli: I agree, it just seems like pure insanity that Jack would seriously say that to the man's face during an interview, one in which
Posted 07/18/08 at 07:48pm
Jack Wessels: If not then... Damn...
Posted 07/18/08 at 07:48pm
Jack Wessels: Hey Dennis, I know you can't share the videos JT sent you, but was there perhaps even a slight amount of sarcasm in his replies?
Posted 07/18/08 at 06:21pm
tallimar: ... news story so much as a punch line.
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